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 Microbe prototype under Unity

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untrustedlife
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:24 am

After a bit of testing the 1 in 2000 thing seems way too rare, i was testing my prototype and if a player had to do this they would be extremely annoyed and probably stop trying.
Should we make these numbers lower , or do you have a better idea..
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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:58 pm

I agree with untrustedlife, 1/2000 is too small. I get the idea of making it realistic and last a bit but the player will give up before. 1/100 is already small.

But those aren't really important in prototyping. You should use something along the line of 1/10-1/100 for test purpose. I'd like to avoid discussing those number in this thread and stick to implementation of game design. If we want to discuss actual values, we can make another thread.

@NickTheNick
I'd be interested in knowing what all those organelle give to the cell in term of actual game design(i.e : Vacuole = Compound MaxValue + 1000)... That's what I'm asking.

@untrustedlife
Nice to see your prototype is taking form! Would it be possible to see it in action and have access to the code ? Don't be scared of showing your code if you think it's a mess. Everyone will learn from it and give you feedback. You should make another thread along mine to show it off. With 2 prototypes, we should get a really good idea of how to implement it in the actual C++ code!
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~sciocont
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:34 pm

Quote :
Thanks for the feedback, another question, if you look back at the list of process that are currently implemented in the game, how should they be brought availaible ? Aerobic respiration comes from mithocondria. What about AmnioAcid Respiration ? What about AminoAcid Biosynthesis ? Are they available from start or from a give organelle ? This is the kind of inputs I would like from you guys.
Quote :
Vacuoles
Lysosomes
Nucleus
Cytoskeleton
Golgi Apparatus
Endoplasmic Reticulum
Ok,
vacuoles will do exactly what you think- adding them increases storage of some compound. The best way to implement this initially is to have vacoules hold starch, and be built up when there is an excess of glucose, and depleted when there is not enough. They should be placed using the cell editor and available immediately Lysosomes don't need to be directly implemented- they just break down trash and food for the cell, but aren't big enough for us to notice. The nucleus is mandatory- it just protects the DNA. No upgrades, but you can change where it is. The cytoskeleton is created through the microbe editor. The golgi apparatus and ER can be placed in the editor, and should be able to be upgraded (the ER upgrades increase protein synthesis efficiency, or something along those lines), but right now we don't need to worry too much about them.

Other forms of basic respiration and synthesis (with amino acids, protiens, etc) (excluding exotic forms- more info below) are automatically available but can be upgraded. We may not actually need to do much with them, since they probably won't affect gameplay directly.

Also, I've been playing the prototype for a while, and, though I might be overlooking something, it seems that turning Aerobic respiration on isn't making a difference in my ATP generation. In modern times, Aerobic respiration delivers ~38 ATP per unit of glucose, whereas anaerobic respiration delivers 2 ATP per unit. We can begin Aerobic respiration as much less advantageous, yielding just another 2 ATP (4 total), and just have mitochondria evolve as organelles form that point. This means we can increase the chance of endosymbiosis to something like 1 in 500. A chance not too small to be inaccessible, but small enough that some gameplay time must be invested before you get mitochondria.

This wikipedia page lists other types of respiration. We don't need to include all of them, but it think it might be interesting to put some of them into the game. I'll look into the chemistry behind them.

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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:53 am

@~sciocont
This is a clear explanation. It helped me understand a couple of concepts. IMO, things like Lysosomes shouldn't be implemented at all. They are hidden process. We should concentrate on having a small list of organelle/process that have actual gameplay/utilities to limit the knowledge barrier to the average player.

@ untrustedlife
It seems like awesome work. I liked how your prototype seems different than mine and you explored differents area. It will give us a better idea on the actual implementation. Can't wait to have a download. Please make it public as soon as possible.
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untrustedlife
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Fri Mar 29, 2013 12:59 am

RodGame wrote:
@~sciocont
This is a clear explanation. It helped me understand a couple of concepts. IMO, things like Lysosomes shouldn't be implemented at all. They are hidden process. We should concentrate on having a small list of organelle/process that have actual gameplay/utilities to limit the knowledge barrier to the average player.

@ untrustedlife
It seems like awesome work. I liked how your prototype seems different than mine and you explored differents area. It will give us a better idea on the actual implementation. Can't wait to have a download. Please make it public as soon as possible.

I added a screenshot showing a small colony of filterers bottom right
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~sciocont
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:41 pm

RodGame wrote:
@~sciocont
This is a clear explanation. It helped me understand a couple of concepts. IMO, things like Lysosomes shouldn't be implemented at all. They are hidden process. We should concentrate on having a small list of organelle/process that have actual gameplay/utilities to limit the knowledge barrier to the average player.
I agree completely- I want to keep this fairly simple for you guys to program and easy for players to understand- That's why so many organelles are initial.

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penumbra espinosa
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:10 am

~sciocont wrote:
RodGame wrote:
@~sciocont
This is a clear explanation. It helped me understand a couple of concepts. IMO, things like Lysosomes shouldn't be implemented at all. They are hidden process. We should concentrate on having a small list of organelle/process that have actual gameplay/utilities to limit the knowledge barrier to the average player.
I agree completely- I want to keep this fairly simple for you guys to program and easy for players to understand- That's why so many organelles are initial.

as long as cells dont become kawaii blobs with kiddy features *cough* SPORE's cell stage *cough*
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Daniferrito
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:41 am

I downloaded the code and messed with it a bit. Sorry i don't have a github for the code. You can find the compiled program here: link

Things i did:

Decreased the movement cost from 1 to 0.2
Doubled the updates per tick.
Moved the background back so it has the same effect than in the current release.
Made it so sugar spawns around the player, but not too close.
Sugar too far away from the player gets deleted, and then instantly repositioned.

That means that wherever you go, there will be sugar, but it never has more than 50 sugar created.

Code for the sugar deletion and addition: (inside ResManagement)
Code:
// Update is called once per frame
   void Update () {
      GameObject[]sugars = GameObject.FindGameObjectsWithTag("Glucose");
      for (int i = 0;i<sugars.Length;i++){
      GameObject sugar = sugars[i];
         if ((GameObject.FindGameObjectWithTag("Player").transform.position-sugar.transform.position).magnitude>radiusSpawnRes){
            Destroy(sugar);
            nbrSugarInSoup--;
         }      }
      while(nbrSugarInSoup < nbrSugarToCreate)
      {
         CreateRes("Sugar");
      }
   }
         
   // Instantiate a glucose prefab on the map
   void CreateRes(string _resType)
   {
      GameObject _curGameObject;
      Vector3 _resPos = Vector3.zero;
      Vector3 _playerPos = GameObject.FindGameObjectWithTag("Player").transform.position;
      while(_resPos==Vector3.zero||Mathf.Sqrt((_resPos.x-_playerPos.x)*(_resPos.x-_playerPos.x)+(_resPos.z-_playerPos.z)*(_resPos.z-_playerPos.z))<radiusNoSpawnRes){
      _resPos = (Random.insideUnitSphere)*radiusSpawnRes;
      _resPos.x+= _playerPos.x;
      _resPos.z+= _playerPos.z;
      _resPos.y = resGlucose.transform.localScale.y/2;
      }
      _curGameObject = Instantiate(resGlucose, _resPos, Quaternion.identity) as GameObject;
      _curGameObject.tag="Glucose";
      nbrSugarInSoup++;
   }
}
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untrustedlife
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:11 am

Looks good Daniferrito, I kind of want to try out unity now
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Doggit
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:08 am

Great work!!!

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Doggit
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:33 am


_________________

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You are a music composer and you can help us? Three simple rules:
1) Have or create a youtube channel
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untrustedlife
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:08 am

Good job showing it off
Will you do mine next?
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Doggit
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:30 pm

untrustedlife wrote:
Good job showing it off
Will you do mine next?

yes what next?

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You are a music composer and you can help us? Three simple rules:
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untrustedlife
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:48 pm

The download is on my post.
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gdt1320
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:12 am

I just want to add here that if you have any questions about how to implement something mathematically or in code let me know. I'm pretty good at this sort of thing. Especially with regards to metabolic pathways.

Edit: If you wanted to ask anything about metabolic pathways, regulation, control, etc. I can probably answer those questions too.
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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Mon Apr 08, 2013 11:47 pm

Cool Nice to see that my work as been looked at by 300 people

I would suggest making category for all your video. You already have around 60 videos. You could make categories for Release, Prototype, Concept Art, Music, ect... It would be much more easier for people to look at the channel. Keep it up!

edit :
@Doggit, I saw that you added your music to the video of my prototype. I tought about adding your music to my game before. I decided against to lower the prototype size as it was only to show off the basics and implementation. I will definitly add music if it get at a later stage.
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Doggit
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe prototype under Unity   Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:00 am

RodGame wrote:


@Doggit, I saw that you added your music to the video of my prototype. I tought about adding your music to my game before. I decided against to lower the prototype size as it was only to show off the basics and implementation. I will definitly add music if it get at a later stage.

Ok perfect

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