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 Microbe Stage Final Draft

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US_of_Alaska
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Sep 25, 2011 9:43 pm

I can make them a bit smoother, i was just trying to keep the poly count down. It is already about 50x the poly count of the wriggler...

I'll go get them smoother and then send you the new map.

And i still don't know what you mean, sorry. I searched for a phospholipid,and all that came up was balls made out of smaller balls...
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:26 pm

Texmap

http://i.imgur.com/8XohQ.png
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:36 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
I can make them a bit smoother, i was just trying to keep the poly count down. It is already about 50x the poly count of the wriggler...

I'll go get them smoother and then send you the new map.

And i still don't know what you mean, sorry. I searched for a phospholipid,and all that came up was balls made out of smaller balls...

A phospholipids makes up a cell membrane - as single units they are a rounded molecule (which is attracted to water) attached to two long sections, so like a tadpole with two tails (Which repel water) --> ==O
Phospholipid bilayers make up cell membranes:

O====O
O====O
O====O

Sometimes certain proteins and organelles like ion/proton pumps, flagella, cilia and receptors will protrude through the membrane.

O====O
O====O
O==((((((=======~~~~~~
O====O
O====O


Enough of that biology lesson,
The actual visual cell membrane itself would be like a thin transparent layer with a slimy shader.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:46 am

...I feel so stupid. I still don't quite get it.

So are we talking about a sphere, with another sphere around it that has a different texture and opacity?
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Sep 26, 2011 5:35 pm

Once again, I applaud your great works, but I fear we may be getting ahead of ourselves.

First off, I haven't seen roadkill confirm or deny our ability to import these models to serve as in-game entities. I'd hate for you to go through all this work and have to can it later.

Secondly, pretty models are all well and good, but unless they animate well they're pointless. Good animation can keep us from noticing bad graphics, but bad animations can tear our eyes away from the most gorgeous models ever created. We need to have animations for moving fowards, backwards, sideways, turning, turning multiple directions rapidly, moving multiple directions rapidly, etc. If even one of these is off, our players will see and be distracted.

It's another reason why I want to see these ragdolled. If we can do that, we only need to put in a few comands for the very end of the flagellum (or whichever organelle we use) and the engine can do the rest.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:25 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
...I feel so stupid. I still don't quite get it.

So are we talking about a sphere, with another sphere around it that has a different texture and opacity?
Basically.

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Sep 26, 2011 11:19 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
...I feel so stupid. I still don't quite get it.

So are we talking about a sphere, with another sphere around it that has a different texture and opacity?

I think what we are looking for is a partially transparent hollow sphere with a mottled texture or bump-map to show the phospholipid heads.
The inside of the cell has a cytoplasmic medium but we probably don't have to distinguish that.

In game when it absorbs something it will fill the hollow space within it and can be seen.

EDIT: And I was bored so I threw together some conceptual cells. I was more tying to find shapes rather than colours.
Spoiler:
 
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:47 pm

Pezzalis wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
...I feel so stupid. I still don't quite get it.

So are we talking about a sphere, with another sphere around it that has a different texture and opacity?

I think what we are looking for is a partially transparent hollow sphere with a mottled texture or bump-map to show the phospholipid heads.
The inside of the cell has a cytoplasmic medium but we probably don't have to distinguish that.

In game when it absorbs something it will fill the hollow space within it and can be seen.

EDIT: And I was bored so I threw together some conceptual cells. I was more tying to find shapes rather than colours.
Spoiler:
 
Those are nice- shape recognition will be very important. I have a couple sketchbook pages full of designs for all of the protocell types.

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:15 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
Once again, I applaud your great works, but I fear we may be getting ahead of ourselves.

First off, I haven't seen roadkill confirm or deny our ability to import these models to serve as in-game entities. I'd hate for you to go through all this work and have to can it later.

Secondly, pretty models are all well and good, but unless they animate well they're pointless. Good animation can keep us from noticing bad graphics, but bad animations can tear our eyes away from the most gorgeous models ever created. We need to have animations for moving fowards, backwards, sideways, turning, turning multiple directions rapidly, moving multiple directions rapidly, etc. If even one of these is off, our players will see and be distracted.

It's another reason why I want to see these ragdolled. If we can do that, we only need to put in a few comands for the very end of the flagellum (or whichever organelle we use) and the engine can do the rest.
1) Someone from the programming side of things okayed .OBJ files. However, i don't know how to export animations. Thus i haven't been too fussed with trying to learn how to animate, which leads me to...

2) Yeah,i don't know how to animate yet. I've done what i could with point editing and keypoints, but beyond the flagellum that is not going to fly. This leads me to...

3) I have no technical capability to ragdoll anything. I am not even aware of how to import these models into an engine. I have not had an education in this area yet, and while i am pursuing i am afraid i am not capable of doing anything of this caliber until i have. So i'm back to being useless :p
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:25 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
1) Someone from the programming side of things okayed .OBJ files. However, i don't know how to export animations. Thus i haven't been too fussed with trying to learn how to animate, which leads me to...

2) Yeah,i don't know how to animate yet. I've done what i could with point editing and keypoints, but beyond the flagellum that is not going to fly. This leads me to...

3) I have no technical capability to ragdoll anything. I am not even aware of how to import these models into an engine. I have not had an education in this area yet, and while i am pursuing i am afraid i am not capable of doing anything of this caliber until i have. So i'm back to being useless :p

Knowing our limitations is half the battle. I just feel that if we can do our hard work to get a nice solid framework, the rest of our workload will be cut in half. That's what I'm pushing for.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:26 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
1) Someone from the programming side of things okayed .OBJ files. However, i don't know how to export animations. Thus i haven't been too fussed with trying to learn how to animate, which leads me to...

2) Yeah,i don't know how to animate yet. I've done what i could with point editing and keypoints, but beyond the flagellum that is not going to fly. This leads me to...

3) I have no technical capability to ragdoll anything. I am not even aware of how to import these models into an engine. I have not had an education in this area yet, and while i am pursuing i am afraid i am not capable of doing anything of this caliber until i have. So i'm back to being useless :p

Knowing our limitations is half the battle. I just feel that if we can do our hard work to get a nice solid framework, the rest of our workload will be cut in half. That's what I'm pushing for.
Just do some models. people love them, you're doing good work. but hold off for a bit until we decide whether we're going to bother with cell stage.

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:03 am

I think i might just try to hone my skills for the time being. That way maybe i can be of more use when we need some modelling done.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:13 pm

Ragdoll physics would be simulated in the game engine itself. Nothing's wrong with 3D, but at the time being 2D is 1,000,000 times easier.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Fri Sep 30, 2011 4:45 pm

roadkillguy wrote:
Ragdoll physics would be simulated in the game engine itself. Nothing's wrong with 3D, but at the time being 2D is 1,000,000 times easier.
First release might not even have graphics, I'd like to put out an alpha evolution simulator to work out the kinks in the evolution system and learn the best ways to define organisms.

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sat Oct 01, 2011 3:51 pm

~sciocont wrote:
roadkillguy wrote:
Ragdoll physics would be simulated in the game engine itself. Nothing's wrong with 3D, but at the time being 2D is 1,000,000 times easier.
First release might not even have graphics, I'd like to put out an alpha evolution simulator to work out the kinks in the evolution system and learn the best ways to define organisms.

Easy, iff you don't mind using the command line.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:42 pm

Okay, i have a few questions.

Would it look better if the Wriggler was defined by points that had lines drawn between them, and would this be handled within the program?

The same question for Heat Eaters and other bacteria-like proto-cells, but with sprites that create a snake (eg a bunch of balls in a snake pattern).

Do you want us to worry about animated sprites yet or should we just get things done?
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sat Oct 01, 2011 10:42 pm

I don't know how to handle animated textures, so stick with single ones. Lines between points will be perfect. We could then texture for each segment.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:13 pm

Okay Scio, if you could do some more sketches for me that'd be rooly cool. I have done these so far today, but i'm unsure on how the rest look (Belgium my biology ignorance!)

Clone Sticker
Heat Eater Body Segment
Heat Eater End Segment
Holder
Poison Sticker
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Admiral Van Tromp
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:58 pm

Very nicely done, nice to see you are making some progress. I've not been very active and I apologize for that, I'm not to good with biology, just throw anything you need at me of 2d art and I can get it done).
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Oct 02, 2011 3:59 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
Okay Scio, if you could do some more sketches for me that'd be rooly cool. I have done these so far today, but i'm unsure on how the rest look (Belgium my biology ignorance!)

Clone Sticker
Heat Eater Body Segment
Heat Eater End Segment
Holder
Poison Sticker

Thank you. I can work with these. I've been kinda busy lately, so it might be a while before they're officially integrated.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:44 pm

roadkillguy wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
Okay Scio, if you could do some more sketches for me that'd be rooly cool. I have done these so far today, but i'm unsure on how the rest look (Belgium my biology ignorance!)

Clone Sticker
Heat Eater Body Segment
Heat Eater End Segment
Holder
Poison Sticker

Thank you. I can work with these. I've been kinda busy lately, so it might be a while before they're officially integrated.
Those look good- I'd like the clone sticker to look a bit more like this:

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:23 am

Can do, i was just working with a virus as my base. So rod with a diamond head, some spider legs and what slightly resembles a penis? Can do. I will do some work tomorrow. Any more concept diagrams for me to work with, Scio?
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:02 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
Can do, i was just working with a virus as my base. So rod with a diamond head, some spider legs and what slightly resembles a penis? Can do. I will do some work tomorrow. Any more concept diagrams for me to work with, Scio?
Let me see... I'll scan some soon...
The head should be an icosahedron, the stem a cylinder.

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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:48 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Let me see... I'll scan some soon...
The head should be an icosahedron, the stem a cylinder.
It'll end up looking like a diamond in the 2d sprite anyways, Scio. But i'll add some faint lines to make it look a bit more like that shape if i can get it to look any good.
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PostSubject: Re: Microbe Stage Final Draft   Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:59 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
~sciocont wrote:
Let me see... I'll scan some soon...
The head should be an icosahedron, the stem a cylinder.
It'll end up looking like a diamond in the 2d sprite anyways, Scio. But i'll add some faint lines to make it look a bit more like that shape if i can get it to look any good.
Ok, I'm just trying to give you as much info as possible.

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