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 Aware Stage Combat

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Tenebrarum
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:25 am

US_of_Alaska wrote:
I think you've got most of it pretty well there, Rex. Nice work.

~sciocont wrote:
That seems pretty thorough to me. It'll be very buggy to start out with just because of the complexity of the orgs, but it's good for now.

*Curtseys*
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:14 pm

Okay, forgive the double-post, but I had an idea.

Does anyone here think they could make a few pictures/diagrams of this? Show the differences between a weapon and a weapon array, a grip weapon or a standard one, a directional attack versus a grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing, etc.? It'd be a nice way to show off to fans on ModDB and would let me double check for any issues in my explination, or holes in the concept.

In other news, "grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing" needs a name. Something nice and universal, like "pounce," or "lunge," or "herpaderp."
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:30 am

Tenebrarum wrote:
Okay, forgive the double-post, but I had an idea.

Does anyone here think they could make a few pictures/diagrams of this? Show the differences between a weapon and a weapon array, a grip weapon or a standard one, a directional attack versus a grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing, etc.? It'd be a nice way to show off to fans on ModDB and would let me double check for any issues in my explination, or holes in the concept.

In other news, "grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing" needs a name. Something nice and universal, like "pounce," or "lunge," or "herpaderp."
I can look over this and do a sketch, then move from there.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Sun Nov 13, 2011 12:36 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Tenebrarum wrote:
Okay, forgive the double-post, but I had an idea.

Does anyone here think they could make a few pictures/diagrams of this? Show the differences between a weapon and a weapon array, a grip weapon or a standard one, a directional attack versus a grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing, etc.? It'd be a nice way to show off to fans on ModDB and would let me double check for any issues in my explination, or holes in the concept.

In other news, "grip-weapon-lunge-attack-thing" needs a name. Something nice and universal, like "pounce," or "lunge," or "herpaderp."
I can look over this and do a sketch, then move from there.
Stick figures are all we need. I just don't have a scanner.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:09 pm

Would it be possible to target attacks at a particular point on the opponent? This will be helpful for strategy - if it is a fast predator, it would be a good idea to go for the legs, disable it, and then flee; it would also be a good idea to go for a weak point and knock it out or kill it; go for the eyes and blind it. These are all good ways to escape being eaten, but the player has to work out which is better in the circumstances, and/or die. It adds a bit of challenge.
Otherwise it's just attack, attack, attack *player slurps drink*, attack, defeat. It would be more enjoyable if it was strategic attack, going for the eyes, disable the leg, not notice the claws, tactical defeat. Then the player can improve and maybe beat the predator once or twice, making it more even, and less repetitive.

Thoughts? (while we wait for Scio's epic rendition of Godzilla fighting GLaDOS to represent different forms of attack (that would be awesome
"It says here you were abandoned. Hah, who want want you anyway: You have a massive head but a tiny brain! It says so right here on your file... Why not eat some of my missiles, it won't affect your weight at all to twelve significant figures! I'll even throw in some cake..."
"Raawwwrrr!!!!"))
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Tenebrarum
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:39 pm

The Uteen wrote:
Would it be possible to target attacks at a particular point on the opponent? This will be helpful for strategy - if it is a fast predator, it would be a good idea to go for the legs, disable it, and then flee; it would also be a good idea to go for a weak point and knock it out or kill it; go for the eyes and blind it. These are all good ways to escape being eaten, but the player has to work out which is better in the circumstances, and/or die. It adds a bit of challenge.
Otherwise it's just attack, attack, attack *player slurps drink*, attack, defeat. It would be more enjoyable if it was strategic attack, going for the eyes, disable the leg, not notice the claws, tactical defeat. Then the player can improve and maybe beat the predator once or twice, making it more even, and less repetitive.

Remember how I mentioned in my longpost directional attacks? The system I want to use is something akin to the system used in Mount and Blade, where the game detects mouse movements and directs your strike accordingly. Part of the point of that is mouse-recital aiming a la FPSs, instead of the Spore standard of a WoW style where one clicks to target, and uses a hotbar to attack.

Advanced damage models really depend on what our engine can handle in the end. Remember, we want to be able to have massive battles with spaceships and boarding parties too. (although we may include damage simplification as scales increase) The hardest part with that is figuring out how the behavior of the AI would need to change as the attacks damage different body parts. It's one thing to say that headshots do more damage, but it's another to cripple a leg to slow down the predator and proceed to try and damage a pincer so the do less damage.

Ideally I want that too, but I don't know what the engine, or our computers, will be able to handle.

Spoiler:
 
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:28 am

Hey I was going through some bear grylls vids and i got an idea. This is about the camera.
When we target (eg click on it to select when on a hunting mode) can we have the camera to zoom out abit (so you can see your surroundings better) and also change angle to to sort of over shoulder but far away?
See this video for what I mean (from utube):
/watch?v=B8JKzhRsOOs&feature=related
Its at 1:58
But this happen from over the left shoulder.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:27 pm

Hey ~scio! Didja ever finish that drawing?
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~sciocont
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:48 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
Hey ~scio! Didja ever finish that drawing?
Belgium. I'll do that.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:54 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Tenebrarum wrote:
Hey ~scio! Didja ever finish that drawing?
Belgium. I'll do that.
Spoiler:
 
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:52 pm

I've given you a solid two weeks scio. If you're struggling to draw, it just goes to prove I have some flaws in the concept, so just spit it out.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Wed Feb 22, 2012 6:11 pm

I was going to do this last night, but then I [wow]took an arrow to the knee[/wow] fell asleep. Can you tell me what this is again? I'm really sorry I haven't been on top of this.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:23 pm

Reread the thread.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:44 pm

Ok, done so, definitely will do this.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:42 am

I have the sketches done. Hopefully they're what you're looking for.

Spoiler:
 

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:25 am

Sorry for my absence. Research papers got in my way.

Perfect. I can definately see the wireframes behind these guys. Directional attacks look like they'd work fine with most of this. My biggest concern is still rear facing weapons. I'm thinking it might be best to either treat them as auto-attacks, or turn the camera when the player is using them. Neither sound particularly good though.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:02 pm

I'd suggest zooming the camera out to see the whole of the creature when an enemy is near. If the player is attacking with just their rear grasper over and over again, the camera can slowly rotate around to look from the side of the creature, whipping back if they stop using it or start using the front facing weapons.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:12 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
I'd suggest zooming the camera out to see the whole of the creature when an enemy is near. If the player is attacking with just their rear grasper over and over again, the camera can slowly rotate around to look from the side of the creature, whipping back if they stop using it or start using the front facing weapons.
The combat system needs to use subtle mouse movements to determine direction of the attack. I don't see how this could work.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:41 pm

Put rear attacks on auto, so long as the player's creature can detect in some way what is behind it. This would allow a donkey to kick a coyote behind it.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:48 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
I'd suggest zooming the camera out to see the whole of the creature when an enemy is near. If the player is attacking with just their rear grasper over and over again, the camera can slowly rotate around to look from the side of the creature, whipping back if they stop using it or start using the front facing weapons.
The combat system needs to use subtle mouse movements to determine direction of the attack. I don't see how this could work.
Hrm... Can we hold up for a second? Are we still going with the point and click interface for Organism Mode? Directional Attacks can work with it, but it doesn't seem that we've ever connected the two.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:40 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
Tenebrarum wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
I'd suggest zooming the camera out to see the whole of the creature when an enemy is near. If the player is attacking with just their rear grasper over and over again, the camera can slowly rotate around to look from the side of the creature, whipping back if they stop using it or start using the front facing weapons.
The combat system needs to use subtle mouse movements to determine direction of the attack. I don't see how this could work.
Hrm... Can we hold up for a second? Are we still going with the point and click interface for Organism Mode? Directional Attacks can work with it, but it doesn't seem that we've ever connected the two.
I would assume we're doing point and click attacks. click on the weapon, then click on the target.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Fri Mar 09, 2012 1:31 pm

~sciocont wrote:
I would assume we're doing point and click attacks. click on the weapon, then click on the target.

Reread the concept. I was proposing a reticle based system of attack, like most western games. You use the mouse wheel or number keys to select a weapon, and move your mouse slightly in the direction you want to attack, holding the LMB. This readies your strike. Release the LMB and you complete your strike. Again, I'm basing the concept off of Mount & Blade. It should let us play around with momentum, blocks, and obsticles without having to change the familiar camera and movement system.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Fri Mar 09, 2012 6:11 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
~sciocont wrote:
I would assume we're doing point and click attacks. click on the weapon, then click on the target.

Reread the concept. I was proposing a reticle based system of attack, like most western games. You use the mouse wheel or number keys to select a weapon, and move your mouse slightly in the direction you want to attack, holding the LMB. This readies your strike. Release the LMB and you complete your strike. Again, I'm basing the concept off of Mount & Blade. It should let us play around with momentum, blocks, and obsticles without having to change the familiar camera and movement system.
From first person, that's great, but in third it may be easier to click on a weapon, then click on a target, and you will strike with that weapon.

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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:21 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Tenebrarum wrote:
~sciocont wrote:
I would assume we're doing point and click attacks. click on the weapon, then click on the target.

Reread the concept. I was proposing a reticle based system of attack, like most western games. You use the mouse wheel or number keys to select a weapon, and move your mouse slightly in the direction you want to attack, holding the LMB. This readies your strike. Release the LMB and you complete your strike. Again, I'm basing the concept off of Mount & Blade. It should let us play around with momentum, blocks, and obsticles without having to change the familiar camera and movement system.
From first person, that's great, but in third it may be easier to click on a weapon, then click on a target, and you will strike with that weapon.
Actually, that sounds great for combat. And it would be easy enough to have a "hold shift to target the enemy and engage combat system" thing going.
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PostSubject: Re: Aware Stage Combat   Fri Mar 09, 2012 11:13 pm

~sciocont wrote:
From first person, that's great, but in third it may be easier to click on a weapon, then click on a target, and you will strike with that weapon.

How so? Again, this is based on an existing combat system, which works in third person.
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