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 How Simple?

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GamerXA
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Mon Aug 02, 2010 5:27 pm

It might be a little strange if the player is the only Eukaryotic Organism on the planet. Prokaryotes can be Multicellular, however not many are on Earth, it's possible that Eukaryotic Cells supplanted them. It is also possible that Eukaryotes never evolve on another planet.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:52 pm

GamerXA wrote:
It might be a little strange if the player is the only Eukaryotic Organism on the planet. Prokaryotes can be Multicellular, however not many are on Earth, it's possible that Eukaryotic Cells supplanted them. It is also possible that Eukaryotes never evolve on another planet.
Yes, but without membrane-bound organelles there is little chance of complex life.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:45 am

Then we should still allow the player to start as the most simple Organism they can and must evolve certain characteristics to help them. Most players and the computer will evolve towards the most successful method でしょう.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:41 am

GamerXA wrote:
Then we should still allow the player to start as the most simple Organism they can and must evolve certain characteristics to help them. Most players and the computer will evolve towards the most successful method でしょう.
Yes, but if that's true then we don't need the extra gameplay, do we? If the end result is the same, why would we want players to evolve without the hope of making something new?

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 2:29 am

In order to allow the player the ability to play as a Prokaryote and possibly find new solutions. Spore limited the player to playing as Animals only, Thrive allows them to play as anything they want and should also include Prokaryotes.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:23 am

GamerXA wrote:
In order to allow the player the ability to play as a Prokaryote and possibly find new solutions. Spore limited the player to playing as Animals only, Thrive allows them to play as anything they want and should also include Prokaryotes.
There's really nothing to do as a prokaryote, and there's only going to be one path forward in evolution, basically, becoming a eukaryote. So you could:

A) stay a prokaryote your entire game and give a beaver a case of the sniffles for fun.
B) evolve into a eukaryote, go from there

That's really all i can see happening, because there's only one "setup" for the cell editor and organism editor. Therefore, it doesn't matter what your cell ends up looking like when you become a complex multicellular organism.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:59 am

~sciocont wrote:
GamerXA wrote:
In order to allow the player the ability to play as a Prokaryote and possibly find new solutions. Spore limited the player to playing as Animals only, Thrive allows them to play as anything they want and should also include Prokaryotes.
There's really nothing to do as a prokaryote, and there's only going to be one path forward in evolution, basically, becoming a eukaryote. So you could:

A) stay a prokaryote your entire game and give a beaver a case of the sniffles for fun.
B) evolve into a eukaryote, go from there

That's really all i can see happening, because there's only one "setup" for the cell editor and organism editor. Therefore, it doesn't matter what your cell ends up looking like when you become a complex multicellular organism.

i still say u should start as a prokaryote and evolve into a eukaryote, whats not fun about being a disease?
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:50 pm

koiboi59 wrote:
~sciocont wrote:
GamerXA wrote:
In order to allow the player the ability to play as a Prokaryote and possibly find new solutions. Spore limited the player to playing as Animals only, Thrive allows them to play as anything they want and should also include Prokaryotes.
There's really nothing to do as a prokaryote, and there's only going to be one path forward in evolution, basically, becoming a eukaryote. So you could:

A) stay a prokaryote your entire game and give a beaver a case of the sniffles for fun.
B) evolve into a eukaryote, go from there

That's really all i can see happening, because there's only one "setup" for the cell editor and organism editor. Therefore, it doesn't matter what your cell ends up looking like when you become a complex multicellular organism.

i still say u should start as a prokaryote and evolve into a eukaryote, whats not fun about being a disease?
There's nothing to do. you reproduce and Belgium Belgium up and that's it. Most prokaryotes can't even move.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 1:55 pm

I agree with Scociont, why not just start out as a really simple protist? You would still get to be a disease, but you could move, and evolve better. Being a disease would get boring after the first 10 minutes.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:01 pm

DragonEye4 wrote:
I agree with Scociont, why not just start out as a really simple protist? You would still get to be a disease, but you could move, and evolve better. Being a disease would get boring after the first 10 minutes.

well im saying u have that omppurtunity, and then u evolve into a eukaryote.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 9:44 pm

koiboi59 wrote:
DragonEye4 wrote:
I agree with Scociont, why not just start out as a really simple protist? You would still get to be a disease, but you could move, and evolve better. Being a disease would get boring after the first 10 minutes.

well im saying u have that omppurtunity, and then u evolve into a eukaryote.
But what would you do, other than watch your cell absorb nutrients, and then split? Seems boring and wasted.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:29 pm

DragonEye4 wrote:
koiboi59 wrote:
DragonEye4 wrote:
I agree with Scociont, why not just start out as a really simple protist? You would still get to be a disease, but you could move, and evolve better. Being a disease would get boring after the first 10 minutes.

well im saying u have that omppurtunity, and then u evolve into a eukaryote.
But what would you do, other than watch your cell absorb nutrients, and then split? Seems boring and wasted.
Thank you.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:02 am

Agreeing with Scio and DragonEye on this point.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 5:11 am

What good is a plant with that frame of mind too, all you do is sit and photosynthesize. If we can become Plants we should allow the player to be Prokaryotes too.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 12:37 pm

GamerXA wrote:
What good is a plant with that frame of mind too, all you do is sit and photosynthesize. If we can become Plants we should allow the player to be Prokaryotes too.
The thing is though, you can basically choose whether or not to become a plant. Nobody wants to start a game staring at a screen watching some bacillus divide. If you want to be a plant and just stand there, that's fine, but having an extremely boring first stage isn't going to draw players in.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:05 pm

I don't think that there are many differences as to how Prokaryotes behave when compared to Eukaryotes. They can both have almost all of the Organelles that would affect most of gameplay.

Speaking of which, the nucleus is very simple when compared to the cell's other Organelles. It could merely evolve in-game by all of the genetic material collecting in the center of a compact vesicle in the center of the cell.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:34 pm

GamerXA wrote:
I don't think that there are many differences as to how Prokaryotes behave when compared to Eukaryotes. They can both have almost all of the Organelles that would affect most of gameplay.

Speaking of which, the nucleus is very simple when compared to the cell's other Organelles. It could merely evolve in-game by all of the genetic material collecting in the center of a compact vesicle in the center of the cell.
Yeah, but all advanced life that we know of needs a nucleus, needs membrane-bound organelles (which prokaryotes DO NOT HAVE). So why would we make the player evolve in one direction. This is like saying, Ok, you're a lizard. Now you HAVE TO evolve into a bird. Why would players want to be limited like that? Why would we want to limit players. And even if we let players become complex without becoming eukaryoitic, that's a major punch towards one of our own goals, which is science. To me, playing as a prokaryote makes no sense at all, sorry.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:00 pm

i agree with scio... if you want a evolution game that has nothing to go with it or has no scientific basis then.... play spore....
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Fri Aug 06, 2010 5:28 am

I would not say that it is like lizards evolving into birds, it would be more akin to having organisms with similar body plans that evolve in the water evolve to have little fur and be streamlined.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Fri Aug 06, 2010 3:31 pm

But you're still essentially forcing one outcome, which is something we want to avoid as much as possible.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Fri Aug 06, 2010 8:48 pm

Forcing the player to already be Eukaryote is also forcing one outcome. I, for one, would like to stay in the Unicellular Phase and mess around, and a few other people might want to too.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Sat Aug 07, 2010 9:54 am

GamerXA wrote:
Forcing the player to already be Eukaryote is also forcing one outcome. I, for one, would like to stay in the Unicellular Phase and mess around, and a few other people might want to too.
Eukaryotes can be single-celled, that is what a protist is.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Sat Aug 07, 2010 12:30 pm

DragonEye4 wrote:
GamerXA wrote:
Forcing the player to already be Eukaryote is also forcing one outcome. I, for one, would like to stay in the Unicellular Phase and mess around, and a few other people might want to too.
Eukaryotes can be single-celled, that is what a protist is.
Not all protists are single-celled. Kelp, for instance is a gigantic, multi-cellular protist.

Gamer- That's true, but it's forcing one less outcome than making them be a prokaryote initially, and sit through the boredom of replicating themselves over and over until they mutate into something eukaryotic. You can do a lot as a eukaryote, even when you are single-celled. However, as a prokaryote, you only carry on homeostasis and replicate yourself. There's not a lot of room for gameplay there.

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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Sat Aug 07, 2010 4:53 pm

So are we to presume that any complex life on an alien planet will have a Nucleus and just stick with that? Or maybe we could just not mention the Nucleus at all, though I could see a few miscellaneous complaints and objections.
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PostSubject: Re: How Simple?   Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:58 pm

GamerXA wrote:
So are we to presume that any complex life on an alien planet will have a Nucleus and just stick with that? Or maybe we could just not mention the Nucleus at all, though I could see a few miscellaneous complaints and objections.
We'll assume all complex life has a nucleus and membrane-bound organelles.

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