Space Monster?

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

I don't quite understand the vacuum concept... T_T

EDIT : And I don't quite het why it woul be impossible for multicellular organisms to form.

Explosive decompression.

So? The organisms that evolved in a nebulae were never exposed to pressure (not much any way), therefore any organisms that developed high body pressure will die. But most organisms wont need to since there is no pressure. So there wont be any organism splats in nebulae if there is life there.

Albalrogue wrote:

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

I don't quite understand the vacuum concept... T_T

EDIT : And I don't quite het why it woul be impossible for multicellular organisms to form.

Explosive decompression.

So? The organisms that evolved in a nebulae were never exposed to pressure (not much any way), therefore any organisms that developed high body pressure will die. But most organisms wont need to since there is no pressure. So there wont be any organism splats in nebulae if there is life there.

Unless some unlucky ones manage to evolve that way and end up splatting, but there would not be many, the gene would not be passed on, it would just be on the odd occasion a mutation occurs.

In answer to your question, you did ask why multi-cellular life couldn't evolve, didn't you?
EDIT: Ah... But the body pressure can't reduce itself to the virtually non-existant pressure of a vacuum.

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

I don't quite understand the vacuum concept... T_T

EDIT : And I don't quite het why it woul be impossible for multicellular organisms to form.

Explosive decompression.

So? The organisms that evolved in a nebulae were never exposed to pressure (not much any way), therefore any organisms that developed high body pressure will die. But most organisms wont need to since there is no pressure. So there wont be any organism splats in nebulae if there is life there.

Unless some unlucky ones manage to evolve that way and end up splatting, but there would not be many, the gene would not be passed on, it would just be on the odd occasion a mutation occurs.

In answer to your question, you did ask why multi-cellular life couldn't evolve, didn't you?

Yes, that was my question.

EDIT : What makes the body pressures is the fluids and gases inside the body. Gas pressure can not be modified to be less or more intence. Fluids however depend on the minerals in it. The for fluids with more minerals will have a higher pressure and vice versa.

And any way, a nebulae is mainly composed of gas right? So wouldn't that gas be sucked up in the vacuum as well? So why do nebulaes exist?
The organisms will adapt to the pressure provided by that gas.

Albalrogue wrote:

And any way, a nebulae is mainly composed of gas right? So wouldn't that gas be sucked up in the vacuum as well? So why do nebulaes exist?
The organisms will adapt to the pressure provided by that gas.

Nebulae have atoms relatively far apart, so the pressure is very low. How would complex organisms work after all without pressure?

Commander Keen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

And any way, a nebulae is mainly composed of gas right? So wouldn't that gas be sucked up in the vacuum as well? So why do nebulaes exist?
The organisms will adapt to the pressure provided by that gas.

Nebulae have atoms relatively far apart, so the pressure is very low. How would complex organisms work after all without pressure?

Cells separating but stay stuck after the separation, creating multicelullar organisms. Then by reproduction, they change generation to gene... well you know how it works.

Albalrogue wrote:

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

I don't quite understand the vacuum concept... T_T

EDIT : And I don't quite het why it woul be impossible for multicellular organisms to form.

Explosive decompression.

So? The organisms that evolved in a nebulae were never exposed to pressure (not much any way), therefore any organisms that developed high body pressure will die. But most organisms wont need to since there is no pressure. So there wont be any organism splats in nebulae if there is life there.

Actually, if the cell walls were string enough, you could get multicellular life, but at any point it would have to be only a few cells deep. This could result in mesh-like organisms. Think space doilies.

~sciocont wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

The Uteen wrote:

Albalrogue wrote:

I don't quite understand the vacuum concept... T_T

EDIT : And I don't quite het why it woul be impossible for multicellular organisms to form.

Explosive decompression.

So? The organisms that evolved in a nebulae were never exposed to pressure (not much any way), therefore any organisms that developed high body pressure will die. But most organisms wont need to since there is no pressure. So there wont be any organism splats in nebulae if there is life there.

Actually, if the cell walls were string enough, you could get multicellular life, but at any point it would have to be only a few cells deep. This could result in mesh-like organisms. Think space doilies.

Sorry but I don't quite understand what mesh and doilies are.

~sciocont wrote:

Regular doily

First off: LOL

Secondly, I'm assuming that most nebula-inhabitants wouldn't intentionally move anywhere. They'd be a sort of extreme drifter.

Thirdly, I'm a little iffy on life APPEARING in nebula, mainly because most evidense points to our life evolving in the deep sea, as extreme pressure makes it far easier for the component parts of life not so much to come together but to STAY together. Now life evolving to survive in nebula, that's perfectly reasonable. Life finds a way.

Note that life simply could not exist in open space. I'm sure everyone knows this already, but it doesn't hurt to double check. You need ALOT of... well... stuff to support life.

Would be epic but tbh Im not a fan of life forming in nebula.

Complex organic chemicals is definitely a yes though. In fact some scientists think that our great great great (Ok its a lot of greats, lets skip a few million) great ancestors (Well the first microbial life) were formed by organic compounds from nebula.

IE a meteor tears through a nebula picking up some chemicals and smashes into earth impregnating it not with life but the fundamental building blocks of life. In the high pressure environment of the deep oceans organic compounds (If not already a primitive form of DNA) were able to form basic life.

I think its a great idea for life to be in nebula but it would just be far to complicated to work out what selection pressures would apply and how it would obtain energy, move, evolve, form societies, construct buildings etc.


As for this whole particle interaction, surely these kind of things could be simpled down...? IE rather than what particle is where in a nebula, how abouts something like:
Nebula Gaseous composition:
Oxygen: 10%
Carbon: 12%
Nitrogen: 13%
Sulfur: 5%
Hydrogen: 60%
Composition could be randomized... From this composition a probability of an organic compound forming could be determined.
IE basically...

Chance of:
CH4 (Methane) = 0.12x0.6x0.6x0.6x0.6 = 0.015552 --> 1.6% chance.

Of course if one really wants you could also include things such as reaction rates, electro negativity difference, but it probably isn't necessary.

From this kind of probability you could determine the chance of finding life in a nebula or the chance of organic compounds forming. Its a little vague but a lot of people here at Thrive are talking about very complex ways of determining things such as efficiency, etc. Perhaps a probability/statistics system is adequate for these types of things?

Sorry ~scio, completely missed that.

Alright, I'm not well versed enough to say whether or not life could form in nebulae. I do agree that in the right circumstances, it could survive.

In any situation, I want to point out that

A. Complex life is possible, especially with ~scio's space doily suggestion. Very plausable.

B. Movement is a practical impossability. We're dealing with drifters here.

C. These guys HAVE to stay small. Not tiny, but no larger than maybe a meter at most, which is a huge streach. There's simply not enough stuff to get much bigger.

D. These guys will be simple. Rarely any more complex then a jellyfish, and never any more complex than perhaps a cyophore. No space whales.

I take it then the creatures will be cobweb style?

Guess it sucks in case anyone wants to play as a space monster civilization.

What about asteroid dwelling creatures?

i think we should rule out "space monster" civilizations, since though fun it's just not feasible when you start speaking about sentience.

I think for simplicity and gameplay reasons, perhaps Space/Nebular Life can only be found as NPC's because I wouldn't really fancy drifting around for years trying to find food.

Sentience I agree is pretty much out of the question as it would be difficult to build structures, form societies and its just so VASTLY different to Planet bound life that it will take a VERY long time to figure out how it would work, and how you could incorporate it into game play.

So perhaps you could find some simple space life in the odd nebula, but I think playing as them wouldn't be practical.

Perhaps as a god tool, but one would just find drifting aimlessly around in space would get quite boring quite fast.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Sorry ~scio, completely missed that.

Alright, I'm not well versed enough to say whether or not life could form in nebulae. I do agree that in the right circumstances, it could survive.

In any situation, I want to point out that

A. Complex life is possible, especially with ~scio's space doily suggestion. Very plausable.

B. Movement is a practical impossability. We're dealing with drifters here.

C. These guys HAVE to stay small. Not tiny, but no larger than maybe a meter at most, which is a huge streach. There's simply not enough stuff to get much bigger.

D. These guys will be simple. Rarely any more complex then a jellyfish, and never any more complex than perhaps a cyophore. No space whales.

QFT. It';s possible, but it's just not interesting to play as. However, they could be important somehow.
As for asteroid life, that's plausible, but it probably wouildn't be any larger than the nebulous life. Sorry George Lucas.

Sentience is not out of the question. Your problems contradict each other. If we think of how to develop buildings and societies in space, it will give us a reason to figure it ot, enabling us to develop buildings and societies in space!