Thrive Game Development
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Thrive Game Development

Development of the evolution game Thrive.
 
HomeHome  PortalPortal  Latest imagesLatest images  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Welcome new and returning members!
If you're new, read around a bit before you post: the odds are we've already covered your suggestion.
If you want to join the development team, sign up and tell us why.
ADMIN is pleased to note that this marquee has finally been updated.
ADMIN reminds you that the Devblog is REQUIRED reading.
Currently: The Microbe Stage GUI is under heavy development
Log in
Username:
Password:
Log in automatically: 
:: I forgot my password
Quick Links
Website
/r/thrive
GitHub
FAQs
Wiki
New Posts
Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Statistics
We have 1675 registered users
The newest registered user is dejo123

Our users have posted a total of 30851 messages in 1411 subjects
Who is online?
In total there are 19 users online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 19 Guests

None

Most users ever online was 443 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:41 pm
Latest topics
» THIS FORUM IS NOW OBSOLETE
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby NickTheNick Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:26 pm

» To all the people who come here looking for thrive.
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby NickTheNick Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:22 pm

» Build Error Code::Blocks / CMake
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby crovea Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:28 pm

» Hello! I can translate in japanese
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby tjwhale Thu Jul 02, 2015 7:23 pm

» On Leave (Offline thread)
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby NickTheNick Wed Jul 01, 2015 12:20 am

» Devblog #14: A Brave New Forum
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby NickTheNick Mon Jun 29, 2015 4:49 am

» Application for Programmer
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby crovea Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:14 am

» Re-Reapplication
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby The Creator Thu Jun 25, 2015 10:57 pm

» Application (programming)
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby crovea Tue Jun 23, 2015 8:00 am

» Achieving Sapience
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby MitochondriaBox Sun Jun 21, 2015 7:03 pm

» Microbe Stage GDD
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby tjwhale Sat Jun 20, 2015 3:44 pm

» Application for Programmer/ Theorist
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby tjwhale Wed Jun 17, 2015 9:56 am

» Application for a 3D Modeler.
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Kaiju4u Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:16 am

» Presentation
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Othithu Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:38 am

» Application of Sorts
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby crovea Sun May 31, 2015 5:06 pm

» want to contribute
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Renzope Sun May 31, 2015 12:58 pm

» Music List Thread (Post New Themes Here)
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Oliveriver Thu May 28, 2015 1:06 pm

» Application: English-Spanish translator
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Renzope Tue May 26, 2015 1:53 pm

» Want to be promoter or project manager
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby TheBudderBros Sun May 24, 2015 9:00 pm

» A new round of Forum Revamps!
Color of Chlorophil Emptyby Oliveriver Wed May 20, 2015 11:32 am


 

 Color of Chlorophil

Go down 
+8
SciFiGamer
Commander Keen
roadkillguy
Mysterious_Calligrapher
US_of_Alaska
~sciocont
Poisson
Tenebrarum
12 posters
Go to page : 1, 2, 3  Next
AuthorMessage
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 5:39 pm

Forgive my terrible spelling.

Now, this is more my double-checking than anything. To my knowledge, most chlorophil is green because our sun is yellow. The spectrum of EMR our sun gives off means that green is the color that takes up just enough sunlight to survive and thrive, but not s much the plant overheats. As such, I think that the following would be the case on other worlds: A bluish sun would have more reddish foliage, and a Redish sun would have the opposite.

Anyone?
Back to top Go down
Poisson
Regular
Poisson


Posts : 322
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-07-07
Age : 29
Location : AK (GMT -9)

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 6:00 pm

I think this one thing we will just have to code in without really allowing the auto-evo to change it. Each star could be tagged with what type of chloraphyl would be ideal on the planets that orbit them, and that is just the color that it would be, no arguing. Letting auto-evo change it means we have to make light actually matter in evolution, and that is getting too detailed for it to be worth the time and memory to actually code into the game. All in favor?
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 6:21 pm

Poisson wrote:
I think this one thing we will just have to code in without really allowing the auto-evo to change it. Each star could be tagged with what type of chloraphyl would be ideal on the planets that orbit them, and that is just the color that it would be, no arguing. Letting auto-evo change it means we have to make light actually matter in evolution, and that is getting too detailed for it to be worth the time and memory to actually code into the game. All in favor?

Aye.

Any thoughts on color?
Back to top Go down
~sciocont
Overall Team Lead
~sciocont


Posts : 3406
Reputation : 138
Join date : 2010-07-06

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 8:53 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
Poisson wrote:
I think this one thing we will just have to code in without really allowing the auto-evo to change it. Each star could be tagged with what type of chloraphyl would be ideal on the planets that orbit them, and that is just the color that it would be, no arguing. Letting auto-evo change it means we have to make light actually matter in evolution, and that is getting too detailed for it to be worth the time and memory to actually code into the game. All in favor?

Aye.

Any thoughts on color?
Can you do a little research? I know red leaves pick up transmitted light better than green ones.
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:19 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Can you do a little research? I know red leaves pick up transmitted light better than green ones.

Those are the only colors found here on Earth, there's no more research to be done, only conjesture.
Back to top Go down
US_of_Alaska
Overall Team Co-Lead
US_of_Alaska


Posts : 1335
Reputation : 29
Join date : 2010-07-07
Age : 31
Location : Australia

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:31 pm

Well get us some scientist conjecture. I'm sure it's out there.
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:36 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
Well get us some scientist conjecture. I'm sure it's out there.

I spent the last couple weekends searching. There really isn't anything out there.
Back to top Go down
US_of_Alaska
Overall Team Co-Lead
US_of_Alaska


Posts : 1335
Reputation : 29
Join date : 2010-07-07
Age : 31
Location : Australia

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:40 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
Well get us some scientist conjecture. I'm sure it's out there.

I spent the last couple weekends searching. There really isn't anything out there.
Really? I could have sworn we had a whole article somewhere back on Svenolutions!
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:48 pm

US_of_Alaska wrote:
Tenebrarum wrote:
US_of_Alaska wrote:
Well get us some scientist conjecture. I'm sure it's out there.

I spent the last couple weekends searching. There really isn't anything out there.
Really? I could have sworn we had a whole article somewhere back on Svenolutions!

If that's true, feel free to smack my lazy belgium.
Back to top Go down
~sciocont
Overall Team Lead
~sciocont


Posts : 3406
Reputation : 138
Join date : 2010-07-06

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Nov 22, 2010 9:58 pm

Quick research so that we can make educated guesses...
1
2
3
4
5
Emissions spectra of our sun

Back to top Go down
Mysterious_Calligrapher
Biome Team Lead
Mysterious_Calligrapher


Posts : 1034
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2010-11-26
Age : 32
Location : Earth, the solar system, the milky way...

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptySat Dec 04, 2010 4:43 pm

Since the red end of the spectrum (heading towards infrared) has the longest wavelength, and the purple/blue area (heading towards ultraviolet) has the shortest, and white and blue stars are more intense than red ones, I'm guessing that the pigments will line up like this:
Red star = purplish pigment. Very dark, to soak up as much radiation as possible, since the'll be recieving less intense light, and loosing as little of it as possible. There will be some variations in pigmentation, just like on earth.
Orange Star = bluish leaves. A more intense star, so the color reflected is closer to the star's color in the spectrum.
Yellow Star = green, see above reason.

However, I don't know about the green and blue stars (not to mention the brown ones) because as the wavelength gets more intense, darker colors will protect more from UV, but the pigments will probably have to be close enough to the light emitted that they reflect a lot of light back to keep the plant from overheating.

maybe someone else will get an idea from this.
Back to top Go down
Mysterious_Calligrapher
Biome Team Lead
Mysterious_Calligrapher


Posts : 1034
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2010-11-26
Age : 32
Location : Earth, the solar system, the milky way...

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyThu Sep 29, 2011 12:01 pm

Necropost is Necro.

Basically, I just came back from lab and have data now on what colors of light are absorbed and which ones transmitted in a pigment. I'll highlight the ones my lab gave me - the rest is deduction.

Absorbed (nm) Transmitted/Reflected (nm)
Red (~680-740nm) Greenish, probably still blue green
Orange (~620-680nm) Blue Green
Yellow Orange (~600-620nm) Blue
Yellow (~580-600nm) Blue Violet (~440-460nm)
Yellow Green (~560-580nm) Violet (~420-440nm)
Green (~540-560nm) Purple
Blue Green (~500-540nm) Red (~680-740nm)Blue (~460-500nm) Orange (~620-680nm)
Blue Violet (~440-460nm) Yellow-orange
Violet (~420-440nm) Yellow (~580-600nm)
Purple (~380-400nm) Green (~540-560nm)

Anyhow, this can be used as a chlorophyll guide because the Transmitted light is the leaf's visible color, and the Absorbed Light is the wavelengths that it wants to absorb. If leaves are maximized to the dominant color being put out of their star, or something pretty close, we have chlorophyll sorted with this handy chart.
Notice that multiple pigmentations are possible - on earth, plum-colored (purple, according to my chem book) leaves are not as common as green leaves, but we definitely have a range of yellow green through blue green leaves, which match up well with a star primarily putting out yellow light. They're enough out of phase to prevent overheating.

Star Color: Red Leaf Absorbtions: Blue Violet, violet, purple Leaf Color Orange, Yellow orange, yellow
Star Color: Orange Leaf Absorbtions: Violet, purple, red Leaf Color: yellow orange, yellow, yellow green
Star Color: Yellow Orange Leaf Absorbtions: Purple, red, Orange Leaf Color: yellow, yellow-green, green
Star Color: Yellow, leaf Absorbtions: Red, orange- yellow orange, purple leaf coloryellow green, green, blue green
Star Color: Yellow Green, Leaf Absorbtions: Red, Orange, Yellow, Leaf color: green, blue green, blue
Star Color: Green, Leaf Absorbtions: Orange, Yellow, Yellow Green, Leaf color: Blue green, blue, blue violet
Star Color: Green blue Leaf Absorbtions: Yellow, Yellow Green, Green Leaf Color: Blue, blue violet, Purple
Star Color: Blue, Leaf Absorbtions: Yellow Green, Green, Blue Green, Leaf Color: Blue Violet, Violet, Purple, maybe some red
Star Color: blue Violet Leaf Absorbtions: Green, Blue Green, Blue Leaf Color: Violet, Purple, Red
Back to top Go down
roadkillguy
Experienced
roadkillguy


Posts : 528
Reputation : 17
Join date : 2010-08-25
Age : 31
Location : Rhode Island

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyThu Sep 29, 2011 2:50 pm

Isn't there a reason for green leaves though? There has to be some sort of optimal color. What amounts of energy is each pigment absorbing?
Back to top Go down
Commander Keen
Industrial Team Lead
Commander Keen


Posts : 1123
Reputation : 36
Join date : 2010-07-23
Location : Czech Republic (not that anyone would know where it is...)

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyThu Sep 29, 2011 3:42 pm

Why even bother with stuff like optimal color? I don't think anyone will check if the color of our leaves scientifically matches the color of the sun. We can just assign a list of leaf colors to each star color (wich Calli already did), and then select from this list randomly.
Back to top Go down
~sciocont
Overall Team Lead
~sciocont


Posts : 3406
Reputation : 138
Join date : 2010-07-06

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyThu Sep 29, 2011 5:17 pm

Commander Keen wrote:
Why even bother with stuff like optimal color? I don't think anyone will check if the color of our leaves scientifically matches the color of the sun. We can just assign a list of leaf colors to each star color (wich Calli already did), and then select from this list randomly.
Yes, but undergrowth leaves on earth usually have a red pigment instead of green, and the data shows us that this is because red leaves soak up more high-wavelength light which penetrates to the undergrowth whereas red light does not. Why is this important? It's due to this exact effect that we are able to have this conversation at all. Red leaves are more nutritious, which is why color vision evolved in primates, which allows humans to see in color.\

I have waited a long time for this data.

But yes, shortcut is probably the best method.

List with some notes:
Spoiler:
Back to top Go down
roadkillguy
Experienced
roadkillguy


Posts : 528
Reputation : 17
Join date : 2010-08-25
Age : 31
Location : Rhode Island

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyThu Sep 29, 2011 8:55 pm

Quote :
Why even bother with stuff like optimal color? I don't think anyone will check if the color of our leaves scientifically matches the color of the sun. We can just assign a list of leaf colors to each star color (wich Calli already did), and then select from this list randomly.

Sure, they wont check. It really doesn't matter, but it's something to evolve towards. Otherwise, if nothing's better than anything else, it will be random.
Back to top Go down
SciFiGamer
Newcomer
SciFiGamer


Posts : 10
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2011-07-02
Age : 27

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyFri Sep 30, 2011 12:43 am

I agree with keen and roadkill. its really unnessecary to go into such tiny details.
Back to top Go down
roadkillguy
Experienced
roadkillguy


Posts : 528
Reputation : 17
Join date : 2010-08-25
Age : 31
Location : Rhode Island

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyFri Sep 30, 2011 1:11 pm

I'm for this. I'm just saying that one needs to absorb more energy than another, so we need data on that.

I think it would be interesting, and simple for an organism to optimize to.
Back to top Go down
~sciocont
Overall Team Lead
~sciocont


Posts : 3406
Reputation : 138
Join date : 2010-07-06

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyFri Sep 30, 2011 4:48 pm

roadkillguy wrote:
Quote :
Why even bother with stuff like optimal color? I don't think anyone will check if the color of our leaves scientifically matches the color of the sun. We can just assign a list of leaf colors to each star color (wich Calli already did), and then select from this list randomly.

Sure, they wont check. It really doesn't matter, but it's something to evolve towards. Otherwise, if nothing's better than anything else, it will be random.
Yeah, a simple table would do. It's just really cool that we know what would happen, you know?
Back to top Go down
Mysterious_Calligrapher
Biome Team Lead
Mysterious_Calligrapher


Posts : 1034
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2010-11-26
Age : 32
Location : Earth, the solar system, the milky way...

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyFri Sep 30, 2011 9:41 pm

~sciocont wrote:
Had notes on my longpost
These are primary wavelengths of light being transmitted by a star, so I covered all my bases in case the primarily transmitted wavelengths were not the same as the visible star color. (Not a Physics major.)

As for Reflected/Transmitted light, they're the same thing. Our lab happened to refer to it as Transmitted light, so I copy-pasta'd it.
Back to top Go down
The Uteen
Sandbox Team Lead
The Uteen


Posts : 1476
Reputation : 70
Join date : 2010-07-06
Age : 28
Location : England, Virgo Supercluster

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptySat Oct 01, 2011 5:41 am

Mysterious_Calligrapher wrote:
~sciocont wrote:
Had notes on my longpost
These are primary wavelengths of light being transmitted by a star, so I covered all my bases in case the primarily transmitted wavelengths were not the same as the visible star color. (Not a Physics major.)

As for Reflected/Transmitted light, they're the same thing. Our lab happened to refer to it as Transmitted light, so I copy-pasta'd it.

Extra colours could be used for biome-pods (artificial light, could be tinted?), for creating biomes of custom plant colour.

It would be interesting for the player to set up lots of them with different light and see the different colours the plants become, and educational.
Back to top Go down
Mysterious_Calligrapher
Biome Team Lead
Mysterious_Calligrapher


Posts : 1034
Reputation : 26
Join date : 2010-11-26
Age : 32
Location : Earth, the solar system, the milky way...

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptySat Oct 01, 2011 7:53 pm

It's not so much that they turn colors, as that when evolving plants which were a certain color survived because they had the right kind of pigment to absorb the appropriate wavelengths from their star....

Sure. Do it for the science fair, Tenebrarum.

Hey, the detail is there in case we need it. And my idea was simply to hardcode star color = leaf color, to prevent spore-esque planetary painting. And to keep it visually interesting, depending on the kind of graphics we end up choosing.
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Oct 03, 2011 4:58 pm

Mysterious_Calligrapher wrote:
It's not so much that they turn colors, as that when evolving plants which were a certain color survived because they had the right kind of pigment to absorb the appropriate wavelengths from their star....

Sure. Do it for the science fair, Tenebrarum.

Hey, the detail is there in case we need it. And my idea was simply to hardcode star color = leaf color, to prevent spore-esque planetary painting. And to keep it visually interesting, depending on the kind of graphics we end up choosing.

Exactly my point. I'm just trying to avoid awkward dissonence between different plant species on a planet a la spore. It doesn't have to be ultra-correct, just a neat little nod to real science. Very minimal. I agree with hard coding star color to chlorophil color. It's just a matter of doing a spot of research and making a list.
Back to top Go down
~sciocont
Overall Team Lead
~sciocont


Posts : 3406
Reputation : 138
Join date : 2010-07-06

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Oct 03, 2011 8:03 pm

Tenebrarum wrote:
Mysterious_Calligrapher wrote:
It's not so much that they turn colors, as that when evolving plants which were a certain color survived because they had the right kind of pigment to absorb the appropriate wavelengths from their star....

Sure. Do it for the science fair, Tenebrarum.

Hey, the detail is there in case we need it. And my idea was simply to hardcode star color = leaf color, to prevent spore-esque planetary painting. And to keep it visually interesting, depending on the kind of graphics we end up choosing.

Exactly my point. I'm just trying to avoid awkward dissonence between different plant species on a planet a la spore. It doesn't have to be ultra-correct, just a neat little nod to real science. Very minimal. I agree with hard coding star color to chlorophil color. It's just a matter of doing a spot of research and making a list.
This reminds me that i still need to do atmospheric maths.
Back to top Go down
Tenebrarum
Society Team Lead
Tenebrarum


Posts : 1179
Reputation : 32
Join date : 2010-10-01
Age : 31
Location : ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil EmptyMon Oct 03, 2011 8:36 pm

~sciocont wrote:
This reminds me that i still need to do atmospheric maths.

Ohey! Would it be feasable to predict a few differences for atmospheric colors too?
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content





Color of Chlorophil Empty
PostSubject: Re: Color of Chlorophil   Color of Chlorophil Empty

Back to top Go down
 
Color of Chlorophil
Back to top 
Page 1 of 3Go to page : 1, 2, 3  Next

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Thrive Game Development :: Development :: Design :: Editors :: Organism-
Jump to: