The official military topic

Commander Keen wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Yes, but what about a city-ship that has weapons? Even if just for self-defence, this idea proves to be rather difficult to concept.

Normal SCs have fortifications as well. It would be just a giant TO that has an SC attached to it. SC doesn't always have to have houses and such, does it?

It just has to have a certain population density. However, it may be difficult to designate a moving object as an SC... I hadn't thought about that...

US_of_Alaska wrote:

However, it may be difficult to designate a moving object as an SC... I hadn't thought about that...

If we want all possibilities, such as nomadic towns or those cityships, we will have to include it somehow. I don't think there would be any problems gameplay wise, just the coding might be quite a lot harder...

Commander Keen wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

However, it may be difficult to designate a moving object as an SC... I hadn't thought about that...

If we want all possibilities, such as nomadic towns or those cityships, we will have to include it somehow. I don't think there would be any problems gameplay wise, just the coding might be quite a lot harder...

Nomadic towns would be too small to be classed as an SC, wouldn't it? And maybe we could just have the ability to check TOs with 'Society Centre' after a certain research.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Nomadic towns would be too small to be classed as an SC, wouldn't it?

Depends on how the game is played. If your nation is nomadic long enough, it's clans/tribes may grow without splitting. I guess you could have about 1000 members in biggest tribes, enough for SCs I think.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

And maybe we could just have the ability to check TOs with 'Society Centre' after a certain research.

Good idea for TO-SCs. Now, we just need the research. What about Advanced Life Support?


Also, nomadic SCs still need to be thought out. Maybe the original SC is destroyed every time they move?

What if the SC designation is based on the density of both organisms and TOs? That would cover nomadic societies that take their weapons and such with them as well as massive, moving structures that happen to house large numbers of organisms.

i'm pretty sure that a moving SC could be implemented in coding easily, it's just coding how it moves automatically that would be difficult, and how the looks would change while it's moving, etc.

Commander Keen wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Nomadic towns would be too small to be classed as an SC, wouldn't it?

Depends on how the game is played. If your nation is nomadic long enough, it's clans/tribes may grow without splitting. I guess you could have about 1000 members in biggest tribes, enough for SCs I think.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

And maybe we could just have the ability to check TOs with 'Society Centre' after a certain research.

Good idea for TO-SCs. Now, we just need the research. What about Advanced Life Support?


Also, nomadic SCs still need to be thought out. Maybe the original SC is destroyed every time they move?

I think maybe Orbital Cities would be better.

I do not believe this is feasible. By definition, a nomadic tribe has no specific Society Centre.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I think maybe Orbital Cities would be better.

But they would not always orbit planets, think of colony ships.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I do not believe this is feasible. By definition, a nomadic tribe has no specific Society Centre.

Maybe no stable SC, but when they stop somewhere for 5 years, erecting a temporary city, they should get an SC, even if it would be destroyed later. Also, how would you control the nation if it had no SCs?

Commander Keen wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I think maybe Orbital Cities would be better.

But they would not always orbit planets, think of colony ships.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I do not believe this is feasible. By definition, a nomadic tribe has no specific Society Centre.

Maybe no stable SC, but when they stop somewhere for 5 years, erecting a temporary city, they should get an SC, even if it would be destroyed later. Also, how would you control the nation if it had no SCs?

Well then maybe just Space Cities or something. I don't think advanced life support would allow you to make an SC on a large TO.

The thing with nomads is that they go where the food is. That means they move around from season to season. They don't generally stay put for 5 years. And you would control it the same way you control it before SCs, through directly instructing each unit what to do. And research would be done by selecting someone and then choosing to interact: examine a related resource inter: research on related building.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Well then maybe just Space Cities or something. I don't think advanced life support would allow you to make an SC on a large TO.

No offense, but Space Cities sounds just as horrible as Advanced Life Support .

US_of_Alaska wrote:

The thing with nomads is that they go where the food is. That means they move around from season to season. They don't generally stay put for 5 years. And you would control it the same way you control it before SCs, through directly instructing each unit what to do. And research would be done by selecting someone and then choosing to interact: examine a related resource inter: research on related building.

Neolithic people did it, they stopped in an area for a few years, built a temporary town and exploited any fertile ground and accessible resources they could find, and then traveled another twenty or so kilometers away. Then they built a new town, exploited the area, moved, built new town again, ...

Also, the problem with ordering each unit manually is that units are too numerous in later ages and it has to happen indenpedently (not every town will be built by player).

How would criminality, happinnes and such things be handled without SCs?

that is a tough question, though i belive pickpocketing was not a issue in the neolithic



bout that, the "space building" tech should allow for a increase of the max size in each level ( i want to make a dyson sphere !!!!)

Commander Keen wrote:

No offense, but Space Cities sounds just as horrible as Advanced Life Support .

Was hoping that was just me being picky... We'll keep thinking and once i get up to that point in the Research Tree we'll really worry.
[quote="Commander Keen"Neolithic people did it, they stopped in an area for a few years, built a temporary town and exploited any fertile ground and accessible resources they could find, and then traveled another twenty or so kilometers away. Then they built a new town, exploited the area, moved, built new town again, ...

Also, the problem with ordering each unit manually is that units are too numerous in later ages and it has to happen indenpedently (not every town will be built by player).

How would criminality, happinnes and such things be handled without SCs?[/quote]
I guess we could have a big red button that destroys SCs, then. If that's what's needed.

But in later ages you will have SCs???

Happiness would be measured in the individual units, using environmental factors like TOs that are around that add happiness, how much food is available, how many deaths are occuring, etc.

Crime and instability are a trickier market. I don't think there is a need to have them in non-SCs, personally. On this level the player would directly control their tribe's nation anyways.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Was hoping that was just me being picky... We'll keep thinking and once i get up to that point in the Research Tree we'll really worry.

I'm like that all the time, I just didn't have much chance to show it yet.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I guess we could have a big red button that destroys SCs, then. If that's what's needed.

This is a good idea, not so much for nomading, but it might be useful for evacuation and such.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

But in later ages you will have SCs???

Depends on how your nation will develop. In a resource poor area or planet, staying in one place might not be the best strategy.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Happiness would be measured in the individual units, using environmental factors like TOs that are around that add happiness, how much food is available, how many deaths are occuring, etc.

But if you have a whole nation nomading, that would mean you have tens of thousands units and each has it's individual happiness, thats going to be though both for computer and the game.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Crime and instability are a trickier market. I don't think there is a need to have them in non-SCs, personally. On this level the player would directly control their tribe's nation anyways.

See previous two arguments.

if you have a pop of over 100 units, even if not an SC, they should be a Emotion amalgam, this could also work with armies and not only nomads, but, what i mean, is that if there are x units in a certain area of the same nation, the computer would process their feelings as a group (but not necessarly their actions )

Commander Keen wrote:

This is a good idea, not so much for nomading, but it might be useful for evacuation and such.

Why not for nomading? I still think it's a good idea if you are really spending five years in one place and then migrating.

Commander Keen wrote:

Depends on how your nation will develop. In a resource poor area or planet, staying in one place might not be the best strategy.

I really don't believe that a nation that is nomadic will ever reach the stage of development that is necessary for a large empire.

Commander Keen wrote:

But if you have a whole nation nomading, that would mean you have tens of thousands units and each has it's individual happiness, thats going to be though both for computer and the game.

Eumesmo's idea is best, but i don't see what's wrong with temporary SCs.

Nomadic nations don't have to develop to large empires. Having ten or so clans, each having their own SC, is going to be a nightmare if he has to micromanage it all personally. That's also the reason why the big red button isn't going to work for nomading.

Edit: Wow, this is the second off-topic page in this thread. Moving SCs really deserve their own topic.

erm, apart from what i said, nomadic sc could work like cityships. while on the move a cityship is still a city right? and on the move the nomads will still trade and such

ya, i know, i was establishing a connection between nomads and city ships (they were refered somewhere )

eumesmo wrote:

ya, i know, i was establishing a connection between nomads and city ships (they were refered somewhere )

As in carry on the conversation here in this thread.

So back on topic

Are we going to be able to assign behaiviors for unit types?

Tenebrarum wrote:

Are we going to be able to assign behaiviors for unit types?

Yes, as long as it's not going to be anything extra complex. Default behaviours could be set in TE, but we also need a way to override it on the battlefield. Right now I'm thinking of a Warzone 2100 like doubleclick menu.

Commander Keen wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

Are we going to be able to assign behaiviors for unit types?

Yes, as long as it's not going to be anything extra complex. Default behaviours could be set in TE, but we also need a way to override it on the battlefield. Right now I'm thinking of a Warzone 2100 like doubleclick menu.

Don't know it.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Commander Keen wrote:

Right now I'm thinking of a Warzone 2100 like doubleclick menu.

Don't know it.

I thought so. Right now I'm trying to find a suitable screenshot where the menu is open and readable.



Edit: Look at the top-left menu. The screen isn't the best quality, but it's the best I could find..

http://blog.warzone2100.de/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/interview-betawidget-bild-2.png

Commander Keen wrote:

I thought so. Right now I'm trying to find a suitable screenshot where the menu is open and readable.



Edit: Look at the top-left menu. The screen isn't the best quality, but it's the best I could find..

http://blog.warzone2100.de/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/interview-betawidget-bild-2.png

Not sure how it would work, but if we can, coolio.