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 I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.

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RodGame
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PostSubject: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:21 pm

Hi there ,
Lately, I’ve been searching for a good open source project to join in. I didn’t find what I was interested in. Then I came upon your game trough a Reddit post. I’ve read all around the Forum/Wiki and am now figuring if I want to join the project. Let me explain you how I see the project right now :

First impression : No website, forum pretty complicated, semi-updated, no link to any source-code/game video. OK.
So I dug a little deeper :
  • Found a wiki(thrivegame.wikidot.com/nav:top) : had to register on the forum to acces the link. 2 Updates 1 year ago, others are 2 year ago.

  • Found a gitHub(github.com/Revolutionary-Games/Thrive) : Last update 2 months ago, contains around 6 files which seems pretty basic.

Now about the forum :
My first impression is that forum is really hard to jump in. There are way too much sub forum on the front page and it’s hard to separate from concept to technical/coding discussions.

It seems the forum exist since mid 2010. I found a lot of discussion happening up until November 2012 then it’s been calm until Feb 2013 which seems to have more discussion going on. I must say it’s pretty motivating to see some of the first registered member still came in the last days/month. I’ve looked at the most recent post. Found mostly two things :
- Concept art, sounds, and heavy discussion about gameplay detail(which isn’t bad)
- Member who join the project, make 2 post and are not heard of anymore.

I haven’t seen a lot of stuffs about coding, technical advancement, to-do list, ect...

I have found a Release page(thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t1069-thrive-releases) without any link to download ?

I think the project lacks a lot of direction. There is clearly a necessity for a central base of information of what is to do, what have been done, and who works on what. It doesn’t need to be too complicated, just have the information available.

I also think NickTheNick is doing an excellent job in trying to give a direction to the project with post such as this one (thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t1085-project-task-managment#21284). I found more about what I was searching on this single post than I’ve done browsing the forum all night long.

I’m not yet part of the project. I’m not even an expert senior coder. However, I’m a serious candidate who would work hard happening I joined a structured project.

You guys just had your biggest exposure with the reddit post. You hit your most user online yesterday. I think a lot of person who would had help just overlooked it for the impression of a project that won’t go anywhere.

Here are things, that, IMO, would give the project credibility

1. Make a simple website (containing this forum) that contain
a. small definition of the project, objective of the project(short, medium and long term). A
b. guide for developer who want to join in( It took me quite a bit of time only to find the language of programmation + library used) : Link to gitHub, information about language + library used…

Just those two things with acces to the forum would give a lot of credibility to the project
2. Have a center of information for everything that is to be done. From what I saw, everytime someone says he want to help, people tell him to look on forum on what he want to work… however there are only discussion about concept, no real development task anywhere. This is also true for art. Asking for specific models/sprite in a big list will result in people working way more on those. (I know there are work towards this point. It needs to keep on this way)

3. Simplify the forum. Split the technical/coding from the concepts/gameplay discussion.

I don’t want to look like an asshole trying to point all flaw in your project. I want to come up as someone willing to help the project get in good shape because it seems like an incredible project and a lot of work has already been done.

I can be of help for the managing part, but really I want to code and I think that’s what need to be done right now. This post explain what I think of it : thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t866-microbe-stage-progress-report

Hope this will spark some discussion because I would really be interested in joining the team.

Thank you for taking the time to read my post,

Rod

edit : Just want to specify that stating my first impression this way is to give you an idea of what new user see when they hit the forum. It's pretty hard to see it this way after you've been working for a long time on a project like this. No offense intented
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Daniferrito
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:15 pm

Yes, the forums are quite dificult to go through. Thanks for pointing out specifics, as you say it is hard to see it when you have been some time involved.

Github: For the latest things coding-wise, look at my branch at the github. Last update is one month ago (i'm working on that), but it is more advanced. Once it is good enough, it should be pushed into the main branch.

The first thing you mention would probably be the FAQ. you can find it at the left, so i won't put a link. About the information on the coding, you can find it at http://thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t932-programming-resources Probably links from the FAQ to the adequate threads would be good.

I was working on getting the programing subforum right. For bigger changes, it would have to be ADMIN who does them.

About the release page, there are 8 links there on the single post. Can't you see them? Maybe it is something for new users, i don't know. Here is the link for the latest release: https://www.dropbox.com/s/1ouvr23s3jzzqzm/dist.rar
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NickTheNick
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:39 pm

I very much appreciate your feedback! It is always necessary for us to increase our efficiency.

Yes, the Wiki has not been updated for some time. Actually, I was meaning to update a couple months ago, but every time I got around to doing it, something in the concept changed or a question or point arose and changes would be made. However, keeping that in mind, I will try to get some new stuff on the wiki soon, and flesh out what is already there.

Yes, there is also a lot ahead of us in code, and little behind us in code, but fortunately, there is a lot behind us in concept.

The issue with the members who come and go is structure. Like you said, there is not very much structure to the project at times. I always try my best to ameliorate this, but I would always appreciate help. Task lists that are updated and maintained, and that stimulate discussion are very important. Like I mentioned somewhere else, I will get to checking and updating the ones I have made soon.

I think that new users cannot access links for the first couple of days, because they always worked for me.

Thank you very much for acknowledging my efforts. I really enjoy working here and helping out.

For your first suggestion, we already have such a website here:
http://revolutionarygamesstudio.webs.com/
I would recommend to Scio, or whoever manages it, to take your suggestion into account. That website actually has a lot of potential, so if we could get it up to date, regularly updated, and filled with some concept and compketed work, then it would really help to bind together the forums, the wiki, and all new visitors. I know its a lot of work, but I really think that it is necessary, I could offer my help as well, but not until later this week.

For suggestion two, I will make sure to get back to my task lists soon.

Dont worry, your ideas and suggestions are always welcome and necessary. It helps streamline the direction of the project. For coding, I recommend you contact Daniferrito, and for management, just PM me, and I would really enjoy the help.

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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:16 pm

Daniferrito wrote:

About the release page, there are 8 links there on the single post. Can't you see them? Maybe it is something for new users, i don't know. Here is the link for the latest release: dropbox.com/s/1ouvr23s3jzzqzm/dist.rar

The link are now working. Have modified it ? Otherwise it might be because I hadn't posted yet or wasn't connected. This should be investigated.

I didn't see your branch until you pointed it. Glad to see development are going on. You should push it soon to give the gitHub some update. Is there anyone else working on this code actively ?

NickTheNick wrote:
Yes, there is also a lot ahead of us in code, and little behind us in code, but fortunately, there is a lot behind us in concept.

I agree with this statement. I still have to read concepts in detail so I get what you have in mind. But as you state, I think it's time for software to grow. As it will grow, concept can be modified as needed.

NickTheNick wrote:
For your first suggestion, we already have such a website here:
revolutionarygamesstudio.webs.com/

After all the search I've done, I never found this website. I stumbled on the modDb a couple time(which doesn't give a lot of information), on the github, wiki and topictraker, but never on the website.It should be shouted in bold to the first person being interested to join in. This lead me to the point of the FAQ.

When I looked at the FAQ on this page : thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t692-frequently-asked-questions#13823, i was sad to not find any answer to my questions. Not that the information isn't pertinent, but because it is a gameplay FAQ. I wanted more of a technical FAQ.

It would be nice to have something quick access such as the FAQ that state : Link to the website, gitHub, wiki + Programming information + HOW TO GET INVOLVED, link to download latest release... There is currently not a lot of information about how to get involve apart from presenting you on the welcome thread.

About the task list, the thing it really need is a centralized place. If i want to help what do I do ? I just click on this easy to find thread that will bring me to a repository of all task to be done(art,sound,software,gameplay discussion...)

If I come up with a more in-depth suggestion for task management, I'll make sure to PM you NickTheNick.

Keep on working guys, I see a lot of pontential for this project





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NickTheNick
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:23 pm

Yes, its a hard website to find, but I think it is concealed since it is quite unfinished. I think it is a good place to work on, improving the website, and making it more accessible from the forums.

A thread on how to get involved would be very useful, and it gives me a good idea. I would have to wait until I have access to something other than a mobile device if I were to start such thread, but if Seregon, Dani, Scio, or one of the other leads wants to create it in the meantime, go ahead.

On such a thread I would include a quick description of Thrive, a task list, and links to all the sub task lists, ie the ones I have made. It would say where to go as a programmer, where to go as a modeller, etc.

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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:33 pm

NickTheNick wrote:

On such a thread I would include a quick description of Thrive, a task list, and links to all the sub task lists, ie the ones I have made. It would say where to go as a programmer, where to go as a modeller, etc.

This is also what I have in mind. Also make sure that this is easy to find and is with the main source of information. I would see it in the Information subforum. This should be at the top and should be the first link any newcomer clink where he will have access to everything.

I just open the last release and even if it is really basic, it is a lot more than nothing. This should also be easily available to everyone.

I have experience in project management and I've seen project fail because of lacks of structure. If you want help, you can PM me NickTheNick and I'll be glad to help you about it.
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Daniferrito
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:36 pm

The links are working for me. Just checked them. However, they are hosted on dropbox, so maybe your computer doesen't like it.

For the coding, it's Seregon and me. However, we have both been busy lately. I will hopefully get something done soon, as i've got more time right now.

I see you posted before i could finish my post. So you got the download working? If so, tell me so i dont worry about it.
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NickTheNick
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:50 pm

RodGame wrote:
I have experience in project management and I've seen project fail because of lacks of structure. If you want help, you can PM me NickTheNick and I'll be glad to help you about it.

Will do.

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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:51 pm

Ok just tested it.

Good news : Links are working.
Bad news : Links are dead for anyone not connected.

Same thing happened in ~sciocont's signature :
2 first link work connected or not,
2 last link work only when connected

Therefore, I think that link from the forum are alive for anyone.
Links to external source are dead when user are not connected.

This should be looked at pretty quickly. This leave a lot of confusion(such as ~sciocont's wiki link that isn't there.. I figured you guy had no wiki when I saw it)
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Daniferrito
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:57 pm

Wow, I never noticed it. If you are not loged in, only internal links show up, but external links jus show up as plain text.
I'll see if i can edit the releases so anyone can see the links. If not, i will temporally put a note saying that links only work for regstered users.
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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:03 pm

Well a quick fix would be to copy/paste raw HTML link for the releases for non-registered user until the problem is fixed.
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Daniferrito
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:08 pm

Just did it
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~sciocont
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:36 pm

I wasn't aware of the linking issue: I'll see if ADMIN can fix it. By the way, welcome.
Can't find a fix for the link issue atm, this may be a problem with our host, but I'll keep looking later.

I'm heading into my school spring break soon, so I can finally have the time to make some major restructuring decisions. One Idea that I've had for a while is to revive the actual website, so any suggestions for that will be considered and possibly implemented. I haven't put a lot of work into organization lately, and I really should keep up to date on it. That's why I've given Nick power recently, he's willing and more than capable of running this while I'm busy with other things.

I think I speak for all of us when I say I'd love to have you on the team. You're obviously intelligent, coherent, and interested in creating this game, and worth a lot more to us than many newcomers, who, as you say, "join the project, make 2 posts and are not heard of anymore."


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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Tue Mar 19, 2013 1:48 am

Very well said Scio.

I second the motion for reviving the website, especially since it makes things easier for the committed joinees.

On the issue of management, I will actually be going on a trip to Ontario on Thursday, for about two weeks, and so for that time I will have limited abilities in overseeing things here. Make sure to keep things running smoothly in the meantime.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:46 am

That was exactly my sentiment when I found this project. I'm already trying to consolidate the various threads about feature ideas into GitHub issues. Such long-running tickets containing little more than requirements have served me well at my workplace.
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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:00 am

I'll leave the IRC chat available on the portal open as much as possible. You guys should do it too so we can have active discussions. Hope to see you there!

Hi ~sciocont,

Thanks for the warm welcome. I'll already have some specific suggestion about the website. I think it would need to be simple and just a frontpage to the real information that would be in the forum/wiki. We can discuss this in detail when time will come.

I don't feel like jumping straight in the coding right now because I have a project to finish first. I also think the basic structure of the code should be done by experimented user. Going all-in without thinking what's ahead never work in project.

Because of this, I'll think I'll have some time to help with the management. I'll get in touch with you guys whenever I have ideas.

@Nimbal,
Hi, I've already read your welcome post and you seems like an experience developer which is really great. I personally don't have a lot of experience with gitHub and shared project. You seems to have some ?

I think you should keep on working on issues and such features to use. This will help work being spread in efficient way.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:26 pm

RodGame wrote:

Thanks for the warm welcome. I'll already have some specific suggestion about the website. I think it would need to be simple and just a frontpage to the real information that would be in the forum/wiki. We can discuss this in detail when time will come.

I don't feel like jumping straight in the coding right now because I have a project to finish first. I also think the basic structure of the code should be done by experimented user. Going all-in without thinking what's ahead never work in project.

Because of this, I'll think I'll have some time to help with the management. I'll get in touch with you guys whenever I have ideas.
I'll put up some new assets and work on copying over current concepts, art, music, etc.

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PerfectOrganismil
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:34 pm

In this game will we be able to recreate dinosaurs?
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RodGame
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PostSubject: Re: I'm interested in joining the project, here is what I think of it yet.   Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:40 pm

I think it was one of the worst thread to ask your question as it is not linked to the question in anyway. It should have been in this one :

http://thrivegame.canadaboard.net/t680p630-miscellaneous-bugs-and-questions-that-don-t-deserve-their-own-thread-thread#22103

I'll still answer it :

The idea is to be able to do whatever you want, in a sense a dinosaur is just a human with a different shape/skin, ect... If you work toward looking like a dinosaur, you will be a dinosaur.

So yes, you should be able to make a dinosaur. If you want to discuss further on the topic, I'd suggest posting on the thread above, where it belongs.
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