The Finalization of Microbe Stage

Herein lie all the concepts for Microbe Stage that i believe are generally agreed upon. Feel free to complain if you don't agree.

- Two-Dimensional playing area (this does not mean 2d graphics, just only two axes)
- Organelles can be assimilated by eating dead protocells (list of pickups is needed)
- AutoEvo will be active, and will work alongside assimilation (mutations + natural selection = evolution)
- Once enough energy is obtained, the player can split to reproduce

Anything anyone has to add to this list?

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Anything anyone has to add to this list?

Nothing here. The only pickups I can think of are way too Spore-esque.

InvaderZim wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Anything anyone has to add to this list?

Nothing here. The only pickups I can think of are way too Spore-esque.

Maybe we should try to base microbe stage off of Spore 2005, The demo Will Wright did. We could use that but refine it to be more realistic, Or we could base it off a micture of Spore 2005 and that one cell game on newgrounds and have the controls feel like spore cell stage. like you do all the movement and stuff like in spore 2008 [The version of spore made for 2 year olds], Have the graphics and cell editor like in Spore 2005 and have it so your cell looks like the cell thingy in said cell game from newgrounds.

I think in the old forums we had pickups for:
- photosynthesis
- better chemical energy conversions (digestion)
- better defense against viruses
- 'weapons' to break down other cells for digestion
- something about glue...

I think it was GamerXA who came up with it all, or it might have been Red... Wait a second... Alright, I'm going to the old, old Evo! Forums for a minute. Wish me luck.

EDIT: Here we go, Red's Microbe Stage Wrap-up. It might be out of date now, but let's have a look anyways.

Quote :

This is a working document, not a final draft! Please read it and suggest changes!
Many aspects of this concept are still too vague to be considered finalized; those areas will be highlighted in another post.

Cell Stage Gameplay
=================

At the beginning of the game, the player will take control of a single-celled, prokaryotic organism. It will be in one of the following shapes, at random:
*Sphere
*Rod
*Comma
*Spiral

The shape of the cell will not initially affect movement.

The player's environment is the "organic soup", a murky screen populated by floating proto-cellular structures. AI proto-cells may include:
1) Wrigglers - Worm-like creatures that move quickly around the screen; assimilating them grants the player a flagellum
2) Writhers - Small globular creatures that move quickly around the screen by rippling cilia on their body; assimilating them grants the player cilia
3) Squirmers - Crescent-shaped creatures that move by undulating themselves up and down like a pair of wings; assimilating them grants the player lamellipodes
4) Squishers - Glob-shaped creatures that move in an amoeba-like fashion, by wriggling their cytoplasm; assimilating them grants the player the ability to move in this way and engulf other cells.
5) Shiners - Small spherical creatures that drift and emit a pale colored light whenever they absorb amino acids; assimilating them grants the player a bioluminescent dot that shines when they feed
6) Clone-Stickers - Tiny globs with a hollow spike (like a hypodermic) that inject their reproductive material into other cells, causing them to die and be replaced by another sticker. Assimilating them grants the player a pilus (hypodermic spike) that can create clones of the player cell in this manner.
7) Poison-stickers - Tiny globs with a hollow spike (like a hypodermic) that inject toxic material into other cells, causing them to die and dissolve into edible material. Assimilating them grants the player a pilus (hypodermic spike) that injects poison.
8 ) Defenders - Tiny capsules that resist being absorbed by cells; assimilating them grants the player an antiphagocytic capsule which defends them from being absorbed by other cells by producing an outer coating of enzyme "slime"
9) Producers - Blobs that cluster around rich regions of the soup, transforming the amino acids into proteins. Assimilating them grants the player double nourishment from absorbing Amino Acids, and allows damaged cell components to be replaced.
10) Dissolvers - Blobs that cluster around proteins and reduce them to amino acids. Assimilating them grants the player double nourishment from absorbing Protein, and allows cells with Walls to be consumed.
11) Eaters - Small globes that absorb proteins and other cells, converting them to energy for reproduction; assimilating them grants the player Mitochondria, which allows them to "eat" carbohydrates.
12) Light-eaters - Small discs that reproduce automatically while exposed to light; assimilating them grants the player Chloroplasts, which transform light into nourishment (carbohydrates)
13) Heat-eaters - Small blobs that reproduce automatically when exposed to heat; assimilating them grants the the player Thermoplasts, which transform heat into nourishment (carbohydrates)
14) Cookers - Small spheres that release enzymes which break down proteins and cells into amino acids; assimilating them grants the player Lysosomes, which give double nourishment from consuming Cells
15) Holders - Hollow membranes that encase whatever molecules they come in contact with; assimilating them grants the player Vacuoles, which can store material to be digested, or compartmentalize harmful substances (like poison or injected reproductive material).
16) Platers - Solid "plates" that reproduce by absorbing proteins; assimilation grants the player Cell Walls, which form a protective barrier around the cell. In silicone-rich environments, these may be 1.5x as hard to puncture/engulf (as they utilize silicate crystals).
17) Gluers - Globs that create a sticky enzyme that can glue cells together. Assimilating them grants the ability to bond with other cells of your type.

Camera angle is locked at a top-down angle on the Z axis; the player can move freely in the X and Y axes. For the first few moments of the game, cell movement will be limited to drifting, with player able to choose direction by clicking. At this point, the objective for the player is to absorb other cells' structures by engulfing certain numbers of them.

Initially, the "soup" is populated with random variants of the AI proto-cells. There should be several different models of every proto-cell for the game to choose from; these will then have their color palette randomly shifted in every new game to create many different-looking proto-cells.

The player's GUI will include a "Nourishment Meter" which will empty at a given rate, and fill as the player consumes proto-cells and other cells. AI cells in the environment will be absorbing proto-cells as well, causing them to become increasingly complex. The player may engulf them by approaching them, provided they are large enough and have the appropriate structures. Initially, they only yield nourishment based on their size, and any structures within them will break down into globs of protein, which are rejected by the player's cell. As the player gains new cell parts, they may gain the ability to digest proteins or carbohydrates produced by other cells.

Every cell, including AI cells, has a Nourishment Meter. Whenever a cell's Nourishment Meter remains filled for a given amount of time, that cell will reproduce. Its offspring will be exactly identical to the parent. If the player cell reproduces, it will release an AI cell of the same type into the environment; cells of similar type to the player's cell will not attack it. If this cell assimilates any new cell structures, it is considered a different species, and will become hostile to the player.

After a given number of organelles are assimilated (exact number TBD), the player will have to assimilate more and more of a given type of proto-cell in order to assimilate it.

When a player's cell absorbs a certain type of proto-cell, it gains the ability to "stick" to other cells of its kind, forming cellular colonies. At this point, the player can become a multicellular organism by bonding with as many cells of its type as possible.

Once a cellular colony has reached a given number of cells (exact number TBD), they will begin to specialize. Outer cells will begin to toughen and become skin membranes; inner cells will become digestion organs. How exactly this process will take place still needs to be determined.

I remember this. However, we came to the conclusion in a different thread that you'll start as a eukaryote, just a very basic one, without many organelles. When you start binding with others, at a certain point you'll unlock the OE and its most basic tools.

So, your organism will change by editing, not by evolution of any means? I hope I understood it in a bad way.

Commander Keen wrote:

So, your organism will change by editing, not by evolution of any means? I hope I understood it in a bad way.

A good point, scio. This will only be if direct-editing is the selected form of evolution, i hope?

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Commander Keen wrote:

So, your organism will change by editing, not by evolution of any means? I hope I understood it in a bad way.

A good point, scio. This will only be if direct-editing is the selected form of evolution, i hope?

Actually, multicellular orgs will have to mutate using the type of construction on the oe, so yes and no.

~sciocont wrote:

Actually, multicellular orgs will have to mutate using the type of construction on the oe, so yes and no.

Evolution will not be exclusive to Direct Editing in the Microbe stage, that is what i am trying to say.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

~sciocont wrote:

Actually, multicellular orgs will have to mutate using the type of construction on the oe, so yes and no.

Evolution will not be exclusive to Direct Editing in the Microbe stage, that is what i am trying to say.

Oh, yeah, of course. We'll probably run a genome a lot like the one in that flash prototype.

~sciocont wrote:

Oh, yeah, of course. We'll probably run a genome a lot like the one in that flash prototype.

Excellent. I'm happy now.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

~sciocont wrote:

Oh, yeah, of course. We'll probably run a genome a lot like the one in that flash prototype.

Excellent. I'm happy now.

The genome used there is a good example of how our genomes (share codes) should look, it was just lacking things like size, a coordinate system for placement, etc.

for a pickup, shouldn't we use acids? stuff like amino or nucleic acid?

koiboi59 wrote:

for a pickup, shouldn't we use acids? stuff like amino or nucleic acid?

Aminos will come from whatever you eat or whatever nutrients you get. we could pick up sections of DNA. That would allow new mutations.

I don't believe that any Organisms evolve by picking up DNA from other Organisms. This is starting to sound much too much like Spore.

GamerXA wrote:

I don't believe that any Organisms evolve by picking up DNA from other Organisms. This is starting to sound much too much like Spore.

It does a little...

And what do we have to pick up to get energy again?

GamerXA wrote:

I don't believe that any Organisms evolve by picking up DNA from other Organisms. This is starting to sound much too much like Spore.

i think i heard of a theroy that the first predator prey scenario was really mating. that when the predator ate its prey, it mates as it absorbs the prey organism. then it would create another with mixed genes. although i dont know how accurate it is.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

GamerXA wrote:

I don't believe that any Organisms evolve by picking up DNA from other Organisms. This is starting to sound much too much like Spore.

It does a little...

And what do we have to pick up to get energy again?

Actually, it's quite common for single-celled organisms to pick up genetic material from their environment.

~sciocont wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

GamerXA wrote:

I don't believe that any Organisms evolve by picking up DNA from other Organisms. This is starting to sound much too much like Spore.

It does a little...

And what do we have to pick up to get energy again?

Actually, it's quite common for single-celled organisms to pick up genetic material from their environment.

Yes but they don't use that genetic material to buy things.

Perhaps the OE at this stage could be ingame...?

How about when you assimilate a new organelle such as a mitochondria, you see it enter your cell by a vesicle or some other means of ingestion, and you have to drag it over to a location in the cell that you think will fit its function.

IE Chloroplasts and eye spots will be more efficient near the outer membrane/wall because they are more exposed to light, The nucleus is more suited in the center of the cell because if it is damaged then your cells DNA will likely be damaged too...
This kind of information could come via help pop ups or it could be left entirely up to the player... perhaps a statistics tab could slide over the screen when you are dragging organelles round and the statistics such as "Chloroplast efficiency" could dynamically update depending on where you are moving it.
The player could also perhaps, duplicate certain organelles at a cost of DNA points Energy/Starch/ATP...? Something that could be assimilated or produced to construct organelles...


I'm not entirely sure what the current concept for the cell editor is but I think it could be cool if it was integrated directly into gameplay.

Same goes for the multicellular editor... If you could dynamically re-organise the formation of your cells, and duplicate organelles inside individuals to produce certain cells, then relocate them to where they are most effective. Kinda like a mini army RTS.

As for auto evo, the organelle location could automatically be assigned to a random location determined along a normal curve - In proximity to other organelles and the cell membrane/wall. (IE Not perfect, but not at a location which poses a disadvantage) Over generations these organelle locations could become more efficeint, and random mutations could cause duplications in certain organelles.

As for Multicelluar the same kind of thing could happen. The computer automatically determines an average position for a certain specialized cell. Random mutations could cause cells to move to totally random locations...
Certain cells may produce twice as much of a certain organelle from mutations and become a new type of specialized cell. At first this cell may not be in a prime location but over generations it may have moved...

Just some ideas

the dragging and such for god mode right Pezzalis? cause in other cases the amount of editing you can do is quite small or oven none. and that will be done auto

eumesmo wrote:

the dragging and such for god mode right Pezzalis? cause in other cases the amount of editing you can do is quite small or oven none. and that will be done auto

Well Im thinking at this stage, a change such as re-locating an organelle is small enough...?

Hmmm

EDIT: 50th post woop woop

Pezzalis wrote:

Perhaps the OE at this stage could be ingame...?

How about when you assimilate a new organelle such as a mitochondria, you see it enter your cell by a vesicle or some other means of ingestion, and you have to drag it over to a location in the cell that you think will fit its function.

IE Chloroplasts and eye spots will be more efficient near the outer membrane/wall because they are more exposed to light, The nucleus is more suited in the center of the cell because if it is damaged then your cells DNA will likely be damaged too...
This kind of information could come via help pop ups or it could be left entirely up to the player... perhaps a statistics tab could slide over the screen when you are dragging organelles round and the statistics such as "Chloroplast efficiency" could dynamically update depending on where you are moving it.
The player could also perhaps, duplicate certain organelles at a cost of DNA points Energy/Starch/ATP...? Something that could be assimilated or produced to construct organelles...

Yes

Quote :

Same goes for the multicellular editor... If you could dynamically re-organise the formation of your cells, and duplicate organelles inside individuals to produce certain cells, then relocate them to where they are most effective. Kinda like a mini army RTS.

No

Quote :

As for auto evo, the organelle location could automatically be assigned to a random location determined along a normal curve - In proximity to other organelles and the cell membrane/wall. (IE Not perfect, but not at a location which poses a disadvantage) Over generations these organelle locations could become more efficeint, and random mutations could cause duplications in certain organelles.

Yes

Quote :

As for Multicelluar the same kind of thing could happen. The computer automatically determines an average position for a certain specialized cell. Random mutations could cause cells to move to totally random locations...
Certain cells may produce twice as much of a certain organelle from mutations and become a new type of specialized cell. At first this cell may not be in a prime location but over generations it may have moved...

No

Right thanks for clearing that up scio ^^

Actually, the organelles from other organisms is real. Chloroplasts and mitochondria both started as bacteria, before they were assimilated by cells of more advanced life.