Extended Research List

GamerXA wrote:

Perhaps it might also need the research of 'Impairment Support', with maybe another name for that research.

Yes. Some species would use a touch alphabet as the or primary means of written communication, and for them, the research "Alphabet" would unlock this touch alphabet. Impairment Support would add a secondary alphabet or mode of communication that could be used by the species' disabled members who cannot use the primary alphabet; for instance, a species that uses a touch alphabet might unlock a secondary smell alphabet that can be used by those individuals whose touch nerves are disabled to the point that they cannot use the main alphabet.

Hunting should enable clothing (Leather).

Will their be any resource prerequisits? Like riquiring wood-like substance for wood crafting, or will it be taken as read?

Canals are something the player can come up with on his own, I would imagine.

Most Medieval societal thing fall into the stereotyped traps present in our society. For example: Serfs aren't forced to be serfs, they have the ability to come and go as they please. Guilds function as a city government with democratically elected officials, and vassalage is merely a way of appointing officials to govern small areas that are to insignificant and numerous for the king to personally oversee.

Music should be changed to written music. Music itself is present in all societies from the start, and should act as a way of preserving specific cultural aspects that normaly would fluctuate.

Chivalry should act as a code of ideals in warfare. All factions following the chivalric code will limit their military actions and dislike nations who do not. For example: No sneak attacks, no fighting on holy days, no attacking civilians, humane treatment of prisoners, etc.

Aesthetics should exist from the begining. All cultures, no matter how primitive, have art.

Alphabet is prevalent in non-sight critters, just in a different way. Sonar would have carving, Smell would have certain chemicals or a brail-like raised alphabet.

Bonuses given by a certain religion are increased the more prevalent said religion is.

Algebra should require mathamatics.

Most historians think the wheel was invented after potters, when the potters' wheel was turned on it's side.

Agriculture should allow construction of farms.

Did you really had to post copy-paste of the entire post from page 6?

Commander Keen wrote:

Did you really had to post copy-paste of the entire post from page 6?

No responce = I assumed it got missed.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Hunting should enable clothing (Leather).

Will their be any resource prerequisits? Like riquiring wood-like substance for wood crafting, or will it be taken as read?

Canals are something the player can come up with on his own, I would imagine.

Most Medieval societal thing fall into the stereotyped traps present in our society. For example: Serfs aren't forced to be serfs, they have the ability to come and go as they please. Guilds function as a city government with democratically elected officials, and vassalage is merely a way of appointing officials to govern small areas that are to insignificant and numerous for the king to personally oversee.

Music should be changed to written music. Music itself is present in all societies from the start, and should act as a way of preserving specific cultural aspects that normaly would fluctuate.

Chivalry should act as a code of ideals in warfare. All factions following the chivalric code will limit their military actions and dislike nations who do not. For example: No sneak attacks, no fighting on holy days, no attacking civilians, humane treatment of prisoners, etc.

Aesthetics should exist from the begining. All cultures, no matter how primitive, have art.

Alphabet is prevalent in non-sight critters, just in a different way. Sonar would have carving, Smell would have certain chemicals or a brail-like raised alphabet.

Bonuses given by a certain religion are increased the more prevalent said religion is.

Algebra should require mathamatics.

Most historians think the wheel was invented after potters, when the potters' wheel was turned on it's side.

Agriculture should allow construction of farms.

I already agreed with the leather thing somewhere.

You gain research in certain areas by working with the materials and/or related buildings, therefore there is not really a need for prerequisite resources.

If we just let the player come up with everything, how about we remove researches completely?

Rex, i know you have a big attachment to the Medieval Eras, but next time you criticize the research list try suggesting improvements instead of telling us how it shouldn't be.

I can agree with written music, it was just easier to write "Music".

Again, what is it that you want to change the research to? Something under Foreign Policy in the Government Section of the Nation Editor?

These researches are not meant to be taken literally. Obviously all nations have the idea of things looking good or bad, but aesthetics is where they start to study what looks good and bad and why.

I am starting to agree with this.

Well however much percentage influence the religion has in SCs will be however much percentage effect their traits have.

It does, just by extension.

Source?

It allows domestication of plants. That is what farming is, no? The only difference is that the player will also have to build some sort of storage building next to the plant crop.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I already agreed with the leather thing somewhere.

In form of sails, not clothing.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

You gain research in certain areas by working with the materials and/or related buildings, therefore there is not really a need for prerequisite resources.

Thanks, missunderstanding.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

If we just let the player come up with everything, how about we remove researches completely?

No need to be so sarcastic. I merely had the image of a player coming up with a complex system of ditches, filling them with water, and getting his race to start transport on them when he finds canals as a research, then stratching his head.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Rex, i know you have a big attachment to the Medieval Eras, but next time you criticize the research list try suggesting improvements instead of telling us how it shouldn't be.

I did. I made the sugestions I wanted to make. The rest is too complex for me to go into. Unless you really want to know the origins of the word 'city.'

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I can agree with written music, it was just easier to write "Music".

Got it. I assume this research is sped up with higher levels of musical entertainment, right?

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Again, what is it that you want to change the research to? Something under Foreign Policy in the Government Section of the Nation Editor?

Chivalry is more of a cultural change. This would effect the people and AI through that. Am I making sense?

US_of_Alaska wrote:

These researches are not meant to be taken literally. Obviously all nations have the idea of things looking good or bad, but aesthetics is where they start to study what looks good and bad and why.

Sorry, missunderstanding. Thanks.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Well however much percentage influence the religion has in SCs will be however much percentage effect their traits have.

Got it.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

It allows domestication of plants. That is what farming is, no? The only difference is that the player will also have to build some sort of storage building next to the plant crop.

I mean being able to designate feilds for crops. That sort of thing.

P.S. Alot of my goals here are just to get what is now assumed to be obvious written down.

Tenebrarum wrote:

In form of sails, not clothing.

My bad. Agree with this, too.

Tenebrarum wrote:

No need to be so sarcastic. I merely had the image of a player coming up with a complex system of ditches, filling them with water, and getting his race to start transport on them when he finds canals as a research, then scratching his head.

Researches that unlock something in the TE usually unlock tags. So in this case the player would be able to designate a design for irrigation canals and have workers build them with a simple click and drag interface. Sure, before that they could do it by hand if they really really wanted, but i think having a set blueprint will speed it up.

Tenebrarum wrote:

I did. I made the sugestions I wanted to make. The rest is too complex for me to go into. Unless you really want to know the origins of the word 'city.'

I need the suggestions to mean something in terms of the game, not in terms of real life.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Got it. I assume this research is sped up with higher levels of musical entertainment, right?

Having more entertainer specialists and buildings would definitely speed this up. See the research production method.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Chivalry is more of a cultural change. This would effect the people and AI through that. Am I making sense?

I still think it would best fit as a foreign policy. Maybe have an option to select "Chivalry" as a foreign policy option. And it would increase order in SCs, wouldn't it?

Tenebrarum wrote:

I mean being able to designate feilds for crops. That sort of thing.

Being able to designate fields is a good idea. Will add.

Tenebrarum wrote:

P.S. Alot of my goals here are just to get what is now assumed to be obvious written down.

If i seem angry, it's just because i'm having a hard time getting everything in my head into words and ideas. It's usually a good thing when we disagree, it creates progress one way or the other.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Researches that unlock something in the TE usually unlock tags. So in this case the player would be able to designate a design for irrigation canals and have workers build them with a simple click and drag interface. Sure, before that they could do it by hand if they really really wanted, but i think having a set blueprint will speed it up.

Got it.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I need the suggestions to mean something in terms of the game, not in terms of real life.

It'd be a very early method of chosing goveners for SCs. The leader choses the first govener, and afterwards rule is hereditary (Allbeit with a manditory oath of allegiance.) If the govener is found guilty of a crime, he is removed and replaced by a man of the leaders chosing, usually the heir apparent of the job.

Guilds are very complex, I'll make another thread to explain.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

I still think it would best fit as a foreign policy. Maybe have an option to select "Chivalry" as a foreign policy option. And it would increase order in SCs, wouldn't it?

It wouldn't really increase order, but it might lessen the loss of happiness caused by an over-abundance of military specialists.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

If i seem angry, it's just because i'm having a hard time getting everything in my head into words and ideas. It's usually a good thing when we disagree, it creates progress one way or the other.

Mkay. Just so long as I'm not subconciously being a reproductive organ masticator.

Tenebrarum wrote:

It'd be a very early method of chosing goveners for SCs. The leader choses the first govener, and afterwards rule is hereditary (Allbeit with a manditory oath of allegiance.) If the govener is found guilty of a crime, he is removed and replaced by a man of the leaders chosing, usually the heir apparent of the job.

I think that there should be a way to allocate governors prior to Vassalage. I mean, Alexander the Great installed governors into every major city he conquered.

Tenebrarum wrote:

It wouldn't really increase order, but it might lessen the loss of happiness caused by an over-abundance of military specialists.

How abouts it makes the military units happier? Or military units produce a slight happiness boost in the SC? Your idea might be a little hard to explain to the player in a single sentence, is what i'm thinking.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Mkay. Just so long as I'm not subconciously being a reproductive organ masticator.

Nice. But no, you're not. Don't worry yourself.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

How abouts it makes the military units happier? Or military units produce a slight happiness boost in the SC? Your idea might be a little hard to explain to the player in a single sentence, is what i'm thinking.

Well, to my knowledge military units will decrease happiness in an SC if there's to many of them. (If not, that should be the case.) Chivilary would reduce or negate that penalty.

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

How abouts it makes the military units happier? Or military units produce a slight happiness boost in the SC? Your idea might be a little hard to explain to the player in a single sentence, is what i'm thinking.

Well, to my knowledge military units will decrease happiness in an SC if there's to many of them. (If not, that should be the case.) Chivilary would reduce or negate that penalty.

Okay. I can agree that garrisoned military units or specialists over a certain percentage would add unhappiness. And chivalry reducing that is easy enough to explain, i think.

Oh, yes! I completely forgot, but at some point we need to have Seperation of Church and State as a research. It's a concept we take for granted, but there are litterally NO culture where it starts out that way.

Tenebrarum wrote:

Oh, yes! I completely forgot, but at some point we need to have Seperation of Church and State as a research. It's a concept we take for granted, but there are litterally NO culture where it starts out that way.

I believe it's called Secularism, and it will come off the research that allows Free Church.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

Oh, yes! I completely forgot, but at some point we need to have Seperation of Church and State as a research. It's a concept we take for granted, but there are litterally NO culture where it starts out that way.

I believe it's called Secularism, and it will come off the research that allows Free Church.

I didn't find it on the current list.

I think it should be fairly early, by the fall of the Western Roman Empire the concept began to work it's way into most surrounding cultures.

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

Oh, yes! I completely forgot, but at some point we need to have Seperation of Church and State as a research. It's a concept we take for granted, but there are litterally NO culture where it starts out that way.

I believe it's called Secularism, and it will come off the research that allows Free Church.

I didn't find it on the current list.

I think it should be fairly early, by the fall of the Western Roman Empire the concept began to work it's way into most surrounding cultures.

Free Church is actually on there already, but i'm not sure about the requisite being Theology. If you have an alternate, i'll definitely look into it.

Secularism is really rather close. It will come off Liberalism and Free Church, i think.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Free Church is actually on there already, but i'm not sure about the requisite being Theology. If you have an alternate, i'll definitely look into it.

Secularism is really rather close. It will come off Liberalism and Free Church, i think.

Perhaps it should come off of philosophy + vassalage? No... That doesn't sound right...

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Free Church is actually on there already, but i'm not sure about the requisite being Theology. If you have an alternate, i'll definitely look into it.

Secularism is really rather close. It will come off Liberalism and Free Church, i think.

Perhaps it should come off of philosophy + vassalage? No... That doesn't sound right...

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

It definately needs something socio-political. How about code of laws?

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

It definately needs something socio-political. How about code of laws?

Too far back, i think. It would allow Free Church to be discovered at the same time as Aesthetics, and well before Fuedalism. Unless if we give it a huge amount of necessary research points, i guess.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

It definately needs something socio-political. How about code of laws?

Too far back, i think. It would allow Free Church to be discovered at the same time as Aesthetics, and well before Fuedalism. Unless if we give it a huge amount of necessary research points, i guess.

There's a bit of a gap between the socio-political researches there.

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

It definately needs something socio-political. How about code of laws?

Too far back, i think. It would allow Free Church to be discovered at the same time as Aesthetics, and well before Fuedalism. Unless if we give it a huge amount of necessary research points, i guess.

There's a bit of a gap between the socio-political researches there.

Religion ones, too. It jumps from Meditation to Theology. The problem is there really isn't much in between.

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Tenebrarum wrote:

US_of_Alaska wrote:

Philosophy sounds like a good requirement, but it needs more than that.

It definately needs something socio-political. How about code of laws?

Too far back, i think. It would allow Free Church to be discovered at the same time as Aesthetics, and well before Fuedalism. Unless if we give it a huge amount of necessary research points, i guess.

There's a bit of a gap between the socio-political researches there.

Religion ones, too. It jumps from Meditation to Theology. The problem is there really isn't much in between.

Let's pull something out of our butts, shall we?

Dual Government:

Prerequisists: Code of Laws, Aristocracy
Enables: Ability to have multiple Heads of State (See western vs. eastern Roman Empires.)
Type: Societal

Tenebrarum wrote:

Let's pull something out of our butts, shall we?

Dual Government:

Prerequisists: Code of Laws, Aristocracy
Enables: Ability to have multiple Heads of State (See western vs. eastern Roman Empires.)
Type: Societal

That still doesn't help with our Free Church problem. And was that really a decision to have two heads of state, or did they divide the nation up into two empires?

the roman empire suffered a period of rupture, but for a while both emperors were co-emperors instead of leaders of different empires

eumesmo wrote:

the roman empire suffered a period of rupture, but for a while both emperors were co-emperors instead of leaders of different empires

But again, did they decide to have a dual government and research how?